Cyclist ‘jumping red light’ hits brain surgery student

The Oxford Times: Student Ashleigh Parry with her mum Denise Buy this photo Student Ashleigh Parry with her mum Denise

A STUDENT who overcame 20 brain operations is facing a further setback after she said she was knocked down by a cyclist jumping a red light.

Oxford University student Ashleigh Parry missed five months of her course last year due to problems from hydrocephalus, the water-on-the-brain condition that she suffers from.

Now the English literature student is facing more time off after breaking two arm bones in the crash in George Street on Monday.

Mum Denise said yesterday: “The poor girl has already been through so much in her life.”

The 48-year-old said her daughter, 20, waited for the green man before stepping out into the road near Debenhams at about 12.45pm.

She said: “This bicycle came at her at full speed and crashed into her. It knocked her flying.”

She said that because of her condition, Miss Parry could have been killed if she had knocked her head.

Ashleigh had her first brain operation when she was nine weeks old and she secured a place at Oxford despite not being able to take exams due to illness.

She said: “She has nearly lost her life so many times through having this condition. She is a remarkable girl and she is a fighter.

“She has done extraordinarily well to achieve what she has.”

The family, from Doncaster, are now appealing for witnesses to the collision to come forward.

Ashleigh, a second year student at Worcester College, said: “It has been heartbreaking. All I want to do is get my work done.

“I enjoy doing my work but I can’t do it when I have only got one arm.”

She said she was not sure what happened on Monday, adding: “The next thing I know I had been thrown to the floor. I could not get up. I was scared I had broken my arm. I was bewildered.”

She was taken to the John Radcliffe Hospital for treatment and the family reported the incident to police.

Mrs Parry said she had seen many cyclists ignoring red lights in the city.

She said: “I do think this is a problem around Oxford. I have seen it time and time again when I have come here.”

Sushila Dhall, chairwoman of Oxford Pedestrians Association, said the junction was badly designed and a zebra crossing would be more appropriate.

She said: “It is very sad that Oxford city centre is not safe place for vulnerable people to walk around in.”

Anyone who saw the collision should call police on 101.

Comments (78)

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8:13am Tue 11 Feb 14

BigAlBiker says...

Didn't the cyclist stop?

I guess not, seems about right for the lot of them, inconsiderate and they think they rule the road.

But hear them squeeeeeel when one of them gets knocked off.
Didn't the cyclist stop? I guess not, seems about right for the lot of them, inconsiderate and they think they rule the road. But hear them squeeeeeel when one of them gets knocked off. BigAlBiker
  • Score: -14

8:50am Tue 11 Feb 14

Leyland Tiger says...

BigAlBiker wrote:
Didn't the cyclist stop?

I guess not, seems about right for the lot of them, inconsiderate and they think they rule the road.

But hear them squeeeeeel when one of them gets knocked off.
What a typically dumb arrogant comment. I saw a car do an illegal 3 point turn this morning and nearly knock a cyclist off. It was extremely close and could have been tragic just like the poor girl here that got knocked off. Does that mean all car drivers are the same? No of course not. Not all cyclists behave this inconsiderately in the same way that not all motor cyclists ride like complete nutters and not all car drivers text whilst driving, drink and drive etc etc.
[quote][p][bold]BigAlBiker[/bold] wrote: Didn't the cyclist stop? I guess not, seems about right for the lot of them, inconsiderate and they think they rule the road. But hear them squeeeeeel when one of them gets knocked off.[/p][/quote]What a typically dumb arrogant comment. I saw a car do an illegal 3 point turn this morning and nearly knock a cyclist off. It was extremely close and could have been tragic just like the poor girl here that got knocked off. Does that mean all car drivers are the same? No of course not. Not all cyclists behave this inconsiderately in the same way that not all motor cyclists ride like complete nutters and not all car drivers text whilst driving, drink and drive etc etc. Leyland Tiger
  • Score: 15

8:58am Tue 11 Feb 14

livid99 says...

Right, lets wait for the cyclists to appear with their statistics about how they are no danger to pedestrians.......

Did this one stop ? Has he been arrested ? I hope this poor girl makes a speedy recovery, and the cyclist gets the book thrown at him in the same way a motorist would for jumping a red light and injuring someone.
Right, lets wait for the cyclists to appear with their statistics about how they are no danger to pedestrians....... Did this one stop ? Has he been arrested ? I hope this poor girl makes a speedy recovery, and the cyclist gets the book thrown at him in the same way a motorist would for jumping a red light and injuring someone. livid99
  • Score: 38

9:14am Tue 11 Feb 14

Andrew:Oxford says...

Sushila Dhall quote:- "Oxford city centre is not safe place for vulnerable people to walk around in.”

So on one hand we have the Greens demanding that we get out of our cars and walk.

Then on the other we have the former City & County Green councillor making a formal statement to the press telling us it's not safe to walk in Oxford.

I will remind the Green Councillors of this on a regular basis I think.
Sushila Dhall quote:- "Oxford city centre is not safe place for vulnerable people to walk around in.” So on one hand we have the Greens demanding that we get out of our cars and walk. Then on the other we have the former City & County Green councillor making a formal statement to the press telling us it's not safe to walk in Oxford. I will remind the Green Councillors of this on a regular basis I think. Andrew:Oxford
  • Score: 7

9:34am Tue 11 Feb 14

Leyland Tiger says...

Perhaps some of you should recall that cyclist who got killed near Appleton by a motorist allegdedly eating a sandwich or texting or whatever. Was there a sudden anti motorist tirade on here? No and my point is because you see someone breaking the law it doesn't mean that everyone else who happens to share that same mode of transport is going to be the same.
I absolutely hope that the guilty party here is caught and punished but it's like some drivers who are involved in accidents and then drive off themselves..........
..............
Perhaps some of you should recall that cyclist who got killed near Appleton by a motorist allegdedly eating a sandwich or texting or whatever. Was there a sudden anti motorist tirade on here? No and my point is because you see someone breaking the law it doesn't mean that everyone else who happens to share that same mode of transport is going to be the same. I absolutely hope that the guilty party here is caught and punished but it's like some drivers who are involved in accidents and then drive off themselves.......... .............. Leyland Tiger
  • Score: 39

9:50am Tue 11 Feb 14

EMBOX2 says...

"Sushila Dhall, chairwoman of Oxford Pedestrians Association, said the junction was badly designed and a zebra crossing would be more appropriate."

Yes Sushila, because a zebra crossing will make cyclists stop and wait more than a set of lights would. *slaps forehead*

Stupid woman.
"Sushila Dhall, chairwoman of Oxford Pedestrians Association, said the junction was badly designed and a zebra crossing would be more appropriate." Yes Sushila, because a zebra crossing will make cyclists stop and wait more than a set of lights would. *slaps forehead* Stupid woman. EMBOX2
  • Score: 31

9:55am Tue 11 Feb 14

Gunslinger says...

Leyland Tiger wrote:
BigAlBiker wrote:
Didn't the cyclist stop?

I guess not, seems about right for the lot of them, inconsiderate and they think they rule the road.

But hear them squeeeeeel when one of them gets knocked off.
What a typically dumb arrogant comment. I saw a car do an illegal 3 point turn this morning and nearly knock a cyclist off. It was extremely close and could have been tragic just like the poor girl here that got knocked off. Does that mean all car drivers are the same? No of course not. Not all cyclists behave this inconsiderately in the same way that not all motor cyclists ride like complete nutters and not all car drivers text whilst driving, drink and drive etc etc.
Are three point turns 'illegal' now - I seem to remember being told to do one on my driving test?
[quote][p][bold]Leyland Tiger[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]BigAlBiker[/bold] wrote: Didn't the cyclist stop? I guess not, seems about right for the lot of them, inconsiderate and they think they rule the road. But hear them squeeeeeel when one of them gets knocked off.[/p][/quote]What a typically dumb arrogant comment. I saw a car do an illegal 3 point turn this morning and nearly knock a cyclist off. It was extremely close and could have been tragic just like the poor girl here that got knocked off. Does that mean all car drivers are the same? No of course not. Not all cyclists behave this inconsiderately in the same way that not all motor cyclists ride like complete nutters and not all car drivers text whilst driving, drink and drive etc etc.[/p][/quote]Are three point turns 'illegal' now - I seem to remember being told to do one on my driving test? Gunslinger
  • Score: 30

9:56am Tue 11 Feb 14

Gunslinger says...

Leyland Tiger wrote:
BigAlBiker wrote:
Didn't the cyclist stop?

I guess not, seems about right for the lot of them, inconsiderate and they think they rule the road.

But hear them squeeeeeel when one of them gets knocked off.
What a typically dumb arrogant comment. I saw a car do an illegal 3 point turn this morning and nearly knock a cyclist off. It was extremely close and could have been tragic just like the poor girl here that got knocked off. Does that mean all car drivers are the same? No of course not. Not all cyclists behave this inconsiderately in the same way that not all motor cyclists ride like complete nutters and not all car drivers text whilst driving, drink and drive etc etc.
Are three point turns 'illegal' now - I seem to remember being told to do one on my driving test?
[quote][p][bold]Leyland Tiger[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]BigAlBiker[/bold] wrote: Didn't the cyclist stop? I guess not, seems about right for the lot of them, inconsiderate and they think they rule the road. But hear them squeeeeeel when one of them gets knocked off.[/p][/quote]What a typically dumb arrogant comment. I saw a car do an illegal 3 point turn this morning and nearly knock a cyclist off. It was extremely close and could have been tragic just like the poor girl here that got knocked off. Does that mean all car drivers are the same? No of course not. Not all cyclists behave this inconsiderately in the same way that not all motor cyclists ride like complete nutters and not all car drivers text whilst driving, drink and drive etc etc.[/p][/quote]Are three point turns 'illegal' now - I seem to remember being told to do one on my driving test? Gunslinger
  • Score: -1

10:25am Tue 11 Feb 14

Richard of Wantage says...

livid99 wrote:
Right, lets wait for the cyclists to appear with their statistics about how they are no danger to pedestrians.......

Did this one stop ? Has he been arrested ? I hope this poor girl makes a speedy recovery, and the cyclist gets the book thrown at him in the same way a motorist would for jumping a red light and injuring someone.
We all appreciate that you are an anti-cycle troll, but it's inappropriate and bad manners to use someone else’s misfortune for your own hobby horse.
[quote][p][bold]livid99[/bold] wrote: Right, lets wait for the cyclists to appear with their statistics about how they are no danger to pedestrians....... Did this one stop ? Has he been arrested ? I hope this poor girl makes a speedy recovery, and the cyclist gets the book thrown at him in the same way a motorist would for jumping a red light and injuring someone.[/p][/quote]We all appreciate that you are an anti-cycle troll, but it's inappropriate and bad manners to use someone else’s misfortune for your own hobby horse. Richard of Wantage
  • Score: -1

10:26am Tue 11 Feb 14

Richard of Wantage says...

BigAlBiker wrote:
Didn't the cyclist stop?

I guess not, seems about right for the lot of them, inconsiderate and they think they rule the road.

But hear them squeeeeeel when one of them gets knocked off.
We all appreciate that you are an anti-cycle troll, but it's inappropriate and bad manners to use someone else’s misfortune for your own hobby horse.
[quote][p][bold]BigAlBiker[/bold] wrote: Didn't the cyclist stop? I guess not, seems about right for the lot of them, inconsiderate and they think they rule the road. But hear them squeeeeeel when one of them gets knocked off.[/p][/quote]We all appreciate that you are an anti-cycle troll, but it's inappropriate and bad manners to use someone else’s misfortune for your own hobby horse. Richard of Wantage
  • Score: 6

10:30am Tue 11 Feb 14

livid99 says...

Richard of Wantage wrote:
livid99 wrote:
Right, lets wait for the cyclists to appear with their statistics about how they are no danger to pedestrians.......

Did this one stop ? Has he been arrested ? I hope this poor girl makes a speedy recovery, and the cyclist gets the book thrown at him in the same way a motorist would for jumping a red light and injuring someone.
We all appreciate that you are an anti-cycle troll, but it's inappropriate and bad manners to use someone else’s misfortune for your own hobby horse.
I am not an anti-cycle troll, I am just someone fed up with the way they behave and get away with it. This girl has been badly hurt by someone jumping a red light - if you want to defend that, go ahead.
Moron
[quote][p][bold]Richard of Wantage[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]livid99[/bold] wrote: Right, lets wait for the cyclists to appear with their statistics about how they are no danger to pedestrians....... Did this one stop ? Has he been arrested ? I hope this poor girl makes a speedy recovery, and the cyclist gets the book thrown at him in the same way a motorist would for jumping a red light and injuring someone.[/p][/quote]We all appreciate that you are an anti-cycle troll, but it's inappropriate and bad manners to use someone else’s misfortune for your own hobby horse.[/p][/quote]I am not an anti-cycle troll, I am just someone fed up with the way they behave and get away with it. This girl has been badly hurt by someone jumping a red light - if you want to defend that, go ahead. Moron livid99
  • Score: 8

10:38am Tue 11 Feb 14

isibuko says...

As always with these things, it turns into pointless bickering between cyclists and drivers. The point is, a careless d*ckhead is a careless d*ckhead no matter what vehicle they're in charge of...and on the flipside there are plenty of decent drivers and plenty of decent cyclists.
As always with these things, it turns into pointless bickering between cyclists and drivers. The point is, a careless d*ckhead is a careless d*ckhead no matter what vehicle they're in charge of...and on the flipside there are plenty of decent drivers and plenty of decent cyclists. isibuko
  • Score: 102

12:10pm Tue 11 Feb 14

Ceeps60 says...

If a car driver had done this and driven off the registration would be taken, they would be traced & prosecuted & so deterred from a repeat performance but with a cyclist riding off there is no deterrent as they can't usually be traced. Which is why everyone gets so very fed up with them. And yes they cycle on the pavements - do I drive on them or do pedestrians walk on the road?- no. They skip red lights - a motorist doing the same would again be traced & prosecuted. A pedestrian skipping a red light would be knocked down!! I rest my case. Lastly can I just say how totally fed up I am with great gaggles of cyclists on the country roads. I thought they were meant to go single file. Why should I drive at 10 or 20 mph behind them til I can get past when they pay not a penny piece to be on the road? Aaaarrrggghhh!!!!
If a car driver had done this and driven off the registration would be taken, they would be traced & prosecuted & so deterred from a repeat performance but with a cyclist riding off there is no deterrent as they can't usually be traced. Which is why everyone gets so very fed up with them. And yes they cycle on the pavements - do I drive on them or do pedestrians walk on the road?- no. They skip red lights - a motorist doing the same would again be traced & prosecuted. A pedestrian skipping a red light would be knocked down!! I rest my case. Lastly can I just say how totally fed up I am with great gaggles of cyclists on the country roads. I thought they were meant to go single file. Why should I drive at 10 or 20 mph behind them til I can get past when they pay not a penny piece to be on the road? Aaaarrrggghhh!!!! Ceeps60
  • Score: -15

12:18pm Tue 11 Feb 14

EMBOX2 says...

Ceeps, much as I agree with you on the tracing of cyclists, car drivers don't actually pay to use the roads, since road tax doesn't actually exist. Your car tax, fuel duty, VAT, etc, just goes into the same pot as all other taxation, so assuming the cyclist(s) have a job, their taxes also pay for the upkeep (or lack of!) of the roads.
Ceeps, much as I agree with you on the tracing of cyclists, car drivers don't actually pay to use the roads, since road tax doesn't actually exist. Your car tax, fuel duty, VAT, etc, just goes into the same pot as all other taxation, so assuming the cyclist(s) have a job, their taxes also pay for the upkeep (or lack of!) of the roads. EMBOX2
  • Score: 18

1:19pm Tue 11 Feb 14

Neonlights says...

Leyland Tiger wrote:
BigAlBiker wrote:
Didn't the cyclist stop?

I guess not, seems about right for the lot of them, inconsiderate and they think they rule the road.

But hear them squeeeeeel when one of them gets knocked off.
What a typically dumb arrogant comment. I saw a car do an illegal 3 point turn this morning and nearly knock a cyclist off. It was extremely close and could have been tragic just like the poor girl here that got knocked off. Does that mean all car drivers are the same? No of course not. Not all cyclists behave this inconsiderately in the same way that not all motor cyclists ride like complete nutters and not all car drivers text whilst driving, drink and drive etc etc.
What was the cyclist doing to warrant almost being knocked off then?

Was he in the car drivers blindspot?
Was the cyclist traveling too fast and thought he could squeeze through whatever gap the motorist had left?
Was it a typical cyclist who thought he was invincible?
Was the cyclist wearing dark clothes, or hi-vis?
Did the cyclist make his presence known?
[quote][p][bold]Leyland Tiger[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]BigAlBiker[/bold] wrote: Didn't the cyclist stop? I guess not, seems about right for the lot of them, inconsiderate and they think they rule the road. But hear them squeeeeeel when one of them gets knocked off.[/p][/quote]What a typically dumb arrogant comment. I saw a car do an illegal 3 point turn this morning and nearly knock a cyclist off. It was extremely close and could have been tragic just like the poor girl here that got knocked off. Does that mean all car drivers are the same? No of course not. Not all cyclists behave this inconsiderately in the same way that not all motor cyclists ride like complete nutters and not all car drivers text whilst driving, drink and drive etc etc.[/p][/quote]What was the cyclist doing to warrant almost being knocked off then? Was he in the car drivers blindspot? Was the cyclist traveling too fast and thought he could squeeze through whatever gap the motorist had left? Was it a typical cyclist who thought he was invincible? Was the cyclist wearing dark clothes, or hi-vis? Did the cyclist make his presence known? Neonlights
  • Score: -16

1:23pm Tue 11 Feb 14

Andy of jericho says...

What a tedious lot you all are, whether anti or pro cyclists. Accidents happen. Not interesting. Take up basket weaving or something
What a tedious lot you all are, whether anti or pro cyclists. Accidents happen. Not interesting. Take up basket weaving or something Andy of jericho
  • Score: 1

1:57pm Tue 11 Feb 14

livid99 says...

Andy of jericho wrote:
What a tedious lot you all are, whether anti or pro cyclists. Accidents happen. Not interesting. Take up basket weaving or something
Nobody is forcing you to read these comments. There are several million other websites you could read.....
[quote][p][bold]Andy of jericho[/bold] wrote: What a tedious lot you all are, whether anti or pro cyclists. Accidents happen. Not interesting. Take up basket weaving or something[/p][/quote]Nobody is forcing you to read these comments. There are several million other websites you could read..... livid99
  • Score: 5

5:19pm Tue 11 Feb 14

sablond oxford says...

i use that crossing at least once a day and unfortunately it is safer to ignore the lights and just cross when its clear!
Poor girl i hope she has a quick recovery!
i use that crossing at least once a day and unfortunately it is safer to ignore the lights and just cross when its clear! Poor girl i hope she has a quick recovery! sablond oxford
  • Score: 18

5:23pm Tue 11 Feb 14

sablond oxford says...

Leyland Tiger wrote:
BigAlBiker wrote:
Didn't the cyclist stop?

I guess not, seems about right for the lot of them, inconsiderate and they think they rule the road.

But hear them squeeeeeel when one of them gets knocked off.
What a typically dumb arrogant comment. I saw a car do an illegal 3 point turn this morning and nearly knock a cyclist off. It was extremely close and could have been tragic just like the poor girl here that got knocked off. Does that mean all car drivers are the same? No of course not. Not all cyclists behave this inconsiderately in the same way that not all motor cyclists ride like complete nutters and not all car drivers text whilst driving, drink and drive etc etc.
If EVERYONE stuck to the rules then there would be no problem. Unfortunately the world is full of people who just don't care, so long as they are ok!
Two wrongs don't make a right, the incident you mention is bad but it doesn't clear all cyclists of doing what they want either.
I hope the cyclist that did this has a conscience and hands themselves in, but somehow i don't think that will happen.
[quote][p][bold]Leyland Tiger[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]BigAlBiker[/bold] wrote: Didn't the cyclist stop? I guess not, seems about right for the lot of them, inconsiderate and they think they rule the road. But hear them squeeeeeel when one of them gets knocked off.[/p][/quote]What a typically dumb arrogant comment. I saw a car do an illegal 3 point turn this morning and nearly knock a cyclist off. It was extremely close and could have been tragic just like the poor girl here that got knocked off. Does that mean all car drivers are the same? No of course not. Not all cyclists behave this inconsiderately in the same way that not all motor cyclists ride like complete nutters and not all car drivers text whilst driving, drink and drive etc etc.[/p][/quote]If EVERYONE stuck to the rules then there would be no problem. Unfortunately the world is full of people who just don't care, so long as they are ok! Two wrongs don't make a right, the incident you mention is bad but it doesn't clear all cyclists of doing what they want either. I hope the cyclist that did this has a conscience and hands themselves in, but somehow i don't think that will happen. sablond oxford
  • Score: 15

5:30pm Tue 11 Feb 14

Dilligaf2010 says...

When the stretch of St. Aldate's was closed between Speedwell St, and Thames St., cyclists were ignoring the signs to dismount, and were cycling along the pavements at the same speed they would have on the road, even when I courteously asked them to push their bikes, as there are elderly residents in the adjacent block, I got torrents of abuse, I tried so hard to hit one with my car as they were speeding past the entrance to the car park, sadly I was either too early, or too late.
When the stretch of St. Aldate's was closed between Speedwell St, and Thames St., cyclists were ignoring the signs to dismount, and were cycling along the pavements at the same speed they would have on the road, even when I courteously asked them to push their bikes, as there are elderly residents in the adjacent block, I got torrents of abuse, I tried so hard to hit one with my car as they were speeding past the entrance to the car park, sadly I was either too early, or too late. Dilligaf2010
  • Score: -31

6:12pm Tue 11 Feb 14

Wanchai says...

Dilligaf2010 wrote:
When the stretch of St. Aldate's was closed between Speedwell St, and Thames St., cyclists were ignoring the signs to dismount, and were cycling along the pavements at the same speed they would have on the road, even when I courteously asked them to push their bikes, as there are elderly residents in the adjacent block, I got torrents of abuse, I tried so hard to hit one with my car as they were speeding past the entrance to the car park, sadly I was either too early, or too late.
So you attempted to knock down a cyclist with your car, as punishment? It wouldn't surprise me if you are telling the truth. There are quite a few like you in Oxford.
[quote][p][bold]Dilligaf2010[/bold] wrote: When the stretch of St. Aldate's was closed between Speedwell St, and Thames St., cyclists were ignoring the signs to dismount, and were cycling along the pavements at the same speed they would have on the road, even when I courteously asked them to push their bikes, as there are elderly residents in the adjacent block, I got torrents of abuse, I tried so hard to hit one with my car as they were speeding past the entrance to the car park, sadly I was either too early, or too late.[/p][/quote]So you attempted to knock down a cyclist with your car, as punishment? It wouldn't surprise me if you are telling the truth. There are quite a few like you in Oxford. Wanchai
  • Score: 15

6:40pm Tue 11 Feb 14

Madi50n says...

Have emailed OM & TVP about Dilligaf2010's admission of attempting to deliberately hit a cyclist with his car.

Thanks to him for proving the point, that some people hate cyclists so much they will attempt to kill them.

Hello Livid, see your usual tripe in these comments, boooooring, every single one of these tired, tired exhausted cliches is so old it's stopped being funny that people are so dumb they think they are true.

Same old people writing the same rubbish who said absolutely nothing about the recent deaths caused by cars on local roads recently. Want to know why? Because I do, I'd love to know why they are so unbelievably incensed by the occasional cyclist causing an accident but say absolutely nothing on the regular stories about deaths caused by motorists.

Unfortunately, we'll never know why, they won't even admit it they hate cyclists and love the motorists out there killing on a daily basis.
Have emailed OM & TVP about Dilligaf2010's admission of attempting to deliberately hit a cyclist with his car. Thanks to him for proving the point, that some people hate cyclists so much they will attempt to kill them. Hello Livid, see your usual tripe in these comments, boooooring, every single one of these tired, tired exhausted cliches is so old it's stopped being funny that people are so dumb they think they are true. Same old people writing the same rubbish who said absolutely nothing about the recent deaths caused by cars on local roads recently. Want to know why? Because I do, I'd love to know why they are so unbelievably incensed by the occasional cyclist causing an accident but say absolutely nothing on the regular stories about deaths caused by motorists. Unfortunately, we'll never know why, they won't even admit it they hate cyclists and love the motorists out there killing on a daily basis. Madi50n
  • Score: 10

7:14pm Tue 11 Feb 14

seamusl says...

all the voices of reason here are wasted, somre superiour attituded oaf will quote how a cyclist will jump lights or motorist will use a mobile the simple fact is that the odds are the wrong doer will get away with it, this poor young women was lucky as opposed to the cyclist who was killed by the (self admitted) sandwich eating driver, lobby your MP for the police to be given funding to do their job ie stopping the offenders of whatever type. I am attacked on my commute by yobs, villified by motorists for the simple reason I ride a bike (and yes I do obey the laws - all of them) Let us fund more police and let us stop the hate attitude, you might need somebodys help one day, will it matter whether they cycle or drive
all the voices of reason here are wasted, somre superiour attituded oaf will quote how a cyclist will jump lights or motorist will use a mobile the simple fact is that the odds are the wrong doer will get away with it, this poor young women was lucky as opposed to the cyclist who was killed by the (self admitted) sandwich eating driver, lobby your MP for the police to be given funding to do their job ie stopping the offenders of whatever type. I am attacked on my commute by yobs, villified by motorists for the simple reason I ride a bike (and yes I do obey the laws - all of them) Let us fund more police and let us stop the hate attitude, you might need somebodys help one day, will it matter whether they cycle or drive seamusl
  • Score: 18

7:39pm Tue 11 Feb 14

Manco1706 says...

EMBOX2 wrote:
Ceeps, much as I agree with you on the tracing of cyclists, car drivers don't actually pay to use the roads, since road tax doesn't actually exist. Your car tax, fuel duty, VAT, etc, just goes into the same pot as all other taxation, so assuming the cyclist(s) have a job, their taxes also pay for the upkeep (or lack of!) of the roads.
Whether or not it's called road tax you still pay tax to use your car on the road. You can sign a SORN to say your car's off road, but the minute your car's back on the road you have to pay the Vehicle Excise Duty.
[quote][p][bold]EMBOX2[/bold] wrote: Ceeps, much as I agree with you on the tracing of cyclists, car drivers don't actually pay to use the roads, since road tax doesn't actually exist. Your car tax, fuel duty, VAT, etc, just goes into the same pot as all other taxation, so assuming the cyclist(s) have a job, their taxes also pay for the upkeep (or lack of!) of the roads.[/p][/quote]Whether or not it's called road tax you still pay tax to use your car on the road. You can sign a SORN to say your car's off road, but the minute your car's back on the road you have to pay the Vehicle Excise Duty. Manco1706
  • Score: -10

7:49pm Tue 11 Feb 14

shippondame says...

Cyclists are oblivious to the danger they cause to pedestrians in Oxford. I believe all cars AND cyclists should be banned permanently from the city centre; between 06:00 and 23:59.
Cyclists are oblivious to the danger they cause to pedestrians in Oxford. I believe all cars AND cyclists should be banned permanently from the city centre; between 06:00 and 23:59. shippondame
  • Score: -20

7:57pm Tue 11 Feb 14

Madi50n says...

Manco1706 wrote:
EMBOX2 wrote:
Ceeps, much as I agree with you on the tracing of cyclists, car drivers don't actually pay to use the roads, since road tax doesn't actually exist. Your car tax, fuel duty, VAT, etc, just goes into the same pot as all other taxation, so assuming the cyclist(s) have a job, their taxes also pay for the upkeep (or lack of!) of the roads.
Whether or not it's called road tax you still pay tax to use your car on the road. You can sign a SORN to say your car's off road, but the minute your car's back on the road you have to pay the Vehicle Excise Duty.
I have a car, band A, I don't pay any VED to put my car on the road, there are a couple of million cars like that. Plus electric & hybrid cars.

You only have to pay it if you pollute the air you drive through.

So here's the thing Manco1706 you have nooooooo idea what you're talking about.
[quote][p][bold]Manco1706[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]EMBOX2[/bold] wrote: Ceeps, much as I agree with you on the tracing of cyclists, car drivers don't actually pay to use the roads, since road tax doesn't actually exist. Your car tax, fuel duty, VAT, etc, just goes into the same pot as all other taxation, so assuming the cyclist(s) have a job, their taxes also pay for the upkeep (or lack of!) of the roads.[/p][/quote]Whether or not it's called road tax you still pay tax to use your car on the road. You can sign a SORN to say your car's off road, but the minute your car's back on the road you have to pay the Vehicle Excise Duty.[/p][/quote]I have a car, band A, I don't pay any VED to put my car on the road, there are a couple of million cars like that. Plus electric & hybrid cars. You only have to pay it if you pollute the air you drive through. So here's the thing Manco1706 you have nooooooo idea what you're talking about. Madi50n
  • Score: 22

8:13pm Tue 11 Feb 14

Manco1706 says...

Madi50n wrote:
Manco1706 wrote:
EMBOX2 wrote:
Ceeps, much as I agree with you on the tracing of cyclists, car drivers don't actually pay to use the roads, since road tax doesn't actually exist. Your car tax, fuel duty, VAT, etc, just goes into the same pot as all other taxation, so assuming the cyclist(s) have a job, their taxes also pay for the upkeep (or lack of!) of the roads.
Whether or not it's called road tax you still pay tax to use your car on the road. You can sign a SORN to say your car's off road, but the minute your car's back on the road you have to pay the Vehicle Excise Duty.
I have a car, band A, I don't pay any VED to put my car on the road, there are a couple of million cars like that. Plus electric & hybrid cars.

You only have to pay it if you pollute the air you drive through.

So here's the thing Manco1706 you have nooooooo idea what you're talking about.
"You only have to pay it if you pollute the air you drive through."

Therefore it is a road tax because you pay to go on the road.
[quote][p][bold]Madi50n[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Manco1706[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]EMBOX2[/bold] wrote: Ceeps, much as I agree with you on the tracing of cyclists, car drivers don't actually pay to use the roads, since road tax doesn't actually exist. Your car tax, fuel duty, VAT, etc, just goes into the same pot as all other taxation, so assuming the cyclist(s) have a job, their taxes also pay for the upkeep (or lack of!) of the roads.[/p][/quote]Whether or not it's called road tax you still pay tax to use your car on the road. You can sign a SORN to say your car's off road, but the minute your car's back on the road you have to pay the Vehicle Excise Duty.[/p][/quote]I have a car, band A, I don't pay any VED to put my car on the road, there are a couple of million cars like that. Plus electric & hybrid cars. You only have to pay it if you pollute the air you drive through. So here's the thing Manco1706 you have nooooooo idea what you're talking about.[/p][/quote]"You only have to pay it if you pollute the air you drive through." Therefore it is a road tax because you pay to go on the road. Manco1706
  • Score: -30

8:51pm Tue 11 Feb 14

Madi50n says...

Manco1706 wrote:
Madi50n wrote:
Manco1706 wrote:
EMBOX2 wrote:
Ceeps, much as I agree with you on the tracing of cyclists, car drivers don't actually pay to use the roads, since road tax doesn't actually exist. Your car tax, fuel duty, VAT, etc, just goes into the same pot as all other taxation, so assuming the cyclist(s) have a job, their taxes also pay for the upkeep (or lack of!) of the roads.
Whether or not it's called road tax you still pay tax to use your car on the road. You can sign a SORN to say your car's off road, but the minute your car's back on the road you have to pay the Vehicle Excise Duty.
I have a car, band A, I don't pay any VED to put my car on the road, there are a couple of million cars like that. Plus electric & hybrid cars.

You only have to pay it if you pollute the air you drive through.

So here's the thing Manco1706 you have nooooooo idea what you're talking about.
"You only have to pay it if you pollute the air you drive through."

Therefore it is a road tax because you pay to go on the road.
Oh my god! Are you being deliberately stupid or are you really this dumb.

I have a car which I drive on the road.

Because it is a band A car I do not pay anything in VED.

Just to be clear.

I drive my car, legally, on the Public roads, and I pay absolutely not one penny in VED to do so. A couple of a million people do the same as me.

You only have to pay VED if you car pollutes more than others, drive a car that doesn't & it costs nothing. Got that? Understand? you do not have to pay a non-existent road tax to put you car on the road, you don't have to pay VED unless you choose to drive a car that attracts tax. Chose one that doesn't and it's free.
[quote][p][bold]Manco1706[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Madi50n[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Manco1706[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]EMBOX2[/bold] wrote: Ceeps, much as I agree with you on the tracing of cyclists, car drivers don't actually pay to use the roads, since road tax doesn't actually exist. Your car tax, fuel duty, VAT, etc, just goes into the same pot as all other taxation, so assuming the cyclist(s) have a job, their taxes also pay for the upkeep (or lack of!) of the roads.[/p][/quote]Whether or not it's called road tax you still pay tax to use your car on the road. You can sign a SORN to say your car's off road, but the minute your car's back on the road you have to pay the Vehicle Excise Duty.[/p][/quote]I have a car, band A, I don't pay any VED to put my car on the road, there are a couple of million cars like that. Plus electric & hybrid cars. You only have to pay it if you pollute the air you drive through. So here's the thing Manco1706 you have nooooooo idea what you're talking about.[/p][/quote]"You only have to pay it if you pollute the air you drive through." Therefore it is a road tax because you pay to go on the road.[/p][/quote]Oh my god! Are you being deliberately stupid or are you really this dumb. I have a car which I drive on the road. Because it is a band A car I do not pay anything in VED. Just to be clear. I drive my car, legally, on the Public roads, and I pay absolutely not one penny in VED to do so. A couple of a million people do the same as me. You only have to pay VED if you car pollutes more than others, drive a car that doesn't & it costs nothing. Got that? Understand? you do not have to pay a non-existent road tax to put you car on the road, you don't have to pay VED unless you choose to drive a car that attracts tax. Chose one that doesn't and it's free. Madi50n
  • Score: 15

10:00pm Tue 11 Feb 14

seamusl says...

1888 Local Government Act gave a cyclist the right to use the road a car has to pay for a license of sorts ie vehicle excise duty NOT road tax also under the present laws as zero emission vehicles cyclists are exempt from this.
Let us try to find the reason why there is this hatred of cycles, is it really the lawless element ? if so surely there would be a rabid press response against the motorist who has the same attitude.
As I keep all possible press comments were I to be knocked off again (with subsequent police reluctance to do anything) I shall seek to prosecute all who have made anti cycle comments as contributing to the attitude resulting in any accident also the gutter press that have inflamed the attitudes of such. Do not think it cannot be done. Let us try a little reasonableness to each other, there are twits (cleaned up) in all types, why join them
1888 Local Government Act gave a cyclist the right to use the road a car has to pay for a license of sorts ie vehicle excise duty NOT road tax also under the present laws as zero emission vehicles cyclists are exempt from this. Let us try to find the reason why there is this hatred of cycles, is it really the lawless element ? if so surely there would be a rabid press response against the motorist who has the same attitude. As I keep all possible press comments were I to be knocked off again (with subsequent police reluctance to do anything) I shall seek to prosecute all who have made anti cycle comments as contributing to the attitude resulting in any accident also the gutter press that have inflamed the attitudes of such. Do not think it cannot be done. Let us try a little reasonableness to each other, there are twits (cleaned up) in all types, why join them seamusl
  • Score: 9

11:52pm Tue 11 Feb 14

Richard of Wantage says...

Unbelievable! A young woman has had a nasty accident and it brings all the anti-cycling trolls out. At least wish her well instead of using the story for your usual anti-cycling tirades. I myself, wish Ashleigh a quick recovery.
Unbelievable! A young woman has had a nasty accident and it brings all the anti-cycling trolls out. At least wish her well instead of using the story for your usual anti-cycling tirades. I myself, wish Ashleigh a quick recovery. Richard of Wantage
  • Score: 19

7:03am Wed 12 Feb 14

Chris To says...

Dilligaf2010 wrote:
When the stretch of St. Aldate's was closed between Speedwell St, and Thames St., cyclists were ignoring the signs to dismount, and were cycling along the pavements at the same speed they would have on the road, even when I courteously asked them to push their bikes, as there are elderly residents in the adjacent block, I got torrents of abuse, I tried so hard to hit one with my car as they were speeding past the entrance to the car park, sadly I was either too early, or too late.
What an incredibly stupid admission of criminal intent.

It's interesting hearing you talk about about cyclists as ''they'' and not some. I remember clearly getting off my bicycle when they were doing the roadworks in that area.
As were the majority of other cyclists.

Although yes some where cycling on the pavement, usually slowly.
[quote][p][bold]Dilligaf2010[/bold] wrote: When the stretch of St. Aldate's was closed between Speedwell St, and Thames St., cyclists were ignoring the signs to dismount, and were cycling along the pavements at the same speed they would have on the road, even when I courteously asked them to push their bikes, as there are elderly residents in the adjacent block, I got torrents of abuse, I tried so hard to hit one with my car as they were speeding past the entrance to the car park, sadly I was either too early, or too late.[/p][/quote]What an incredibly stupid admission of criminal intent. It's interesting hearing you talk about about cyclists as ''they'' and not some. I remember clearly getting off my bicycle when they were doing the roadworks in that area. As were the majority of other cyclists. Although yes some where cycling on the pavement, usually slowly. Chris To
  • Score: 7

8:38am Wed 12 Feb 14

druss says...

I'm a cyclist, don't drive never have done. On a daily basis I see other cyclists (albeit a minority) ignore red lights, pedestrian crossings, cycling at speed on narrow pavements and generally being d**kheads, I also see pedestrians (also a minority of them) blindly stepping out onto the roads while on the phone and generally not paying attention. I also see drivers constantly on their phones while attempting busy junctions/roundabout
s/traffic lights. Not so much the chosen mode of transport but rather the people I feel.
get well soon young lady :)
I'm a cyclist, don't drive never have done. On a daily basis I see other cyclists (albeit a minority) ignore red lights, pedestrian crossings, cycling at speed on narrow pavements and generally being d**kheads, I also see pedestrians (also a minority of them) blindly stepping out onto the roads while on the phone and generally not paying attention. I also see drivers constantly on their phones while attempting busy junctions/roundabout s/traffic lights. Not so much the chosen mode of transport but rather the people I feel. get well soon young lady :) druss
  • Score: 28

8:54am Wed 12 Feb 14

Deadwoodward says...

Just because motorists do stupid things, it does not stop us criticising cyclists who go whizzing through red lights. It is stupid, dangerous, illegal.
Just because motorists do stupid things, it does not stop us criticising cyclists who go whizzing through red lights. It is stupid, dangerous, illegal. Deadwoodward
  • Score: 2

9:30am Wed 12 Feb 14

LouiseOxford says...

Dilligaf2010 wrote:
When the stretch of St. Aldate's was closed between Speedwell St, and Thames St., cyclists were ignoring the signs to dismount, and were cycling along the pavements at the same speed they would have on the road, even when I courteously asked them to push their bikes, as there are elderly residents in the adjacent block, I got torrents of abuse, I tried so hard to hit one with my car as they were speeding past the entrance to the car park, sadly I was either too early, or too late.
You tried to seriously injure another human being?? What is wrong with you?! If I thought the police would take me seriously I would report you for this absolutely abhorrent and severely unhinged behaviour.
[quote][p][bold]Dilligaf2010[/bold] wrote: When the stretch of St. Aldate's was closed between Speedwell St, and Thames St., cyclists were ignoring the signs to dismount, and were cycling along the pavements at the same speed they would have on the road, even when I courteously asked them to push their bikes, as there are elderly residents in the adjacent block, I got torrents of abuse, I tried so hard to hit one with my car as they were speeding past the entrance to the car park, sadly I was either too early, or too late.[/p][/quote]You tried to seriously injure another human being?? What is wrong with you?! If I thought the police would take me seriously I would report you for this absolutely abhorrent and severely unhinged behaviour. LouiseOxford
  • Score: 16

10:52am Wed 12 Feb 14

Richard Wickson says...

Although I am from Oxford in now live in Cheshire and I can tell you it's not just Oxford where some cyclists jump red lights and ride accross pedestrian crossings. I am both a cyclist and a car driver and was a HGV driver for over 30 years and in my time have seen it all, I have even been knocked off my bike by another cyclist riding into the back of me when I stopped at a red light and he went mad at me for stopping,telling me it was my fault his wheel was now buckled, not his for not stopping. We all make mistakes on the road and sadly some cause irreparable damage and loss of life, it's the thoughtlessness that really gets to me, people jumping lights and ignoring pedestrians on crossings deliberately. They now tell us that it's going to be illegall to smoke in a car whilst children are on board, it's a joke as the present laws about not using phones are not policed, every day anywhere in the country you will see people ignoring the law and chatting merrily away. It's not laws that need changing its attitudes, this girl has gone through so much in her life now some selfish mindless idiot has caused her more suffering and setback, he knows who he or she is and I hope they are totally ashamed but I very much doubt it and I am sure next time they are out on their cycle they will ride through a red light again as if it was their right!
Although I am from Oxford in now live in Cheshire and I can tell you it's not just Oxford where some cyclists jump red lights and ride accross pedestrian crossings. I am both a cyclist and a car driver and was a HGV driver for over 30 years and in my time have seen it all, I have even been knocked off my bike by another cyclist riding into the back of me when I stopped at a red light and he went mad at me for stopping,telling me it was my fault his wheel was now buckled, not his for not stopping. We all make mistakes on the road and sadly some cause irreparable damage and loss of life, it's the thoughtlessness that really gets to me, people jumping lights and ignoring pedestrians on crossings deliberately. They now tell us that it's going to be illegall to smoke in a car whilst children are on board, it's a joke as the present laws about not using phones are not policed, every day anywhere in the country you will see people ignoring the law and chatting merrily away. It's not laws that need changing its attitudes, this girl has gone through so much in her life now some selfish mindless idiot has caused her more suffering and setback, he knows who he or she is and I hope they are totally ashamed but I very much doubt it and I am sure next time they are out on their cycle they will ride through a red light again as if it was their right! Richard Wickson
  • Score: 13

12:06pm Wed 12 Feb 14

LadyJ says...

What's sadly inevitable about any story like this is that instantly we fall into the trap of lumping members of a perceived minority together. Any one of us can think of numerous examples of drivers (and pedestrians) doing unbelievably stupid things, but we never automatically think this reflects on all other drivers or pedestrians. As druss says, it's the people, not the mode of transport.

I hope this young lady recovers quickly, sounds like a horrible experience, particularly on top of all she's been through.
What's sadly inevitable about any story like this is that instantly we fall into the trap of lumping members of a perceived minority together. Any one of us can think of numerous examples of drivers (and pedestrians) doing unbelievably stupid things, but we never automatically think this reflects on all other drivers or pedestrians. As druss says, it's the people, not the mode of transport. I hope this young lady recovers quickly, sounds like a horrible experience, particularly on top of all she's been through. LadyJ
  • Score: 12

12:16pm Wed 12 Feb 14

seamusl says...

Richard Wickson you are 100% correct, the major problem is the "doesn't apply to me" brigade of both sexes all ages caste and education, unfortunately there are far to many of them. Re the subject of the more extreme posts here maybe OM should police their comments page and delete the inflammatory posts thus making people at least appear to seem reasonable, some of these are completely over the top.
Richard Wickson you are 100% correct, the major problem is the "doesn't apply to me" brigade of both sexes all ages caste and education, unfortunately there are far to many of them. Re the subject of the more extreme posts here maybe OM should police their comments page and delete the inflammatory posts thus making people at least appear to seem reasonable, some of these are completely over the top. seamusl
  • Score: 8

12:42pm Wed 12 Feb 14

olafpalme says...

I can't find any at the moment to prove myself wrong, but when there is a car accident (not involving a cyclist!) report is there even an open comments section here on the Daily, I mean Oxford, Mail?
Because even if there is/was, I doubt people would have the bad taste to *speculate* on whether a driver was tweeting on the phone etc. Yet, any story with a cyclist...and the whole `breed' of human known as `cyclists' ( I am one, and a pedestrian, and a driver) is smeared with one negative brush.
I can't find any at the moment to prove myself wrong, but when there is a car accident (not involving a cyclist!) report is there even an open comments section here on the Daily, I mean Oxford, Mail? Because even if there is/was, I doubt people would have the bad taste to *speculate* on whether a driver was tweeting on the phone etc. Yet, any story with a cyclist...and the whole `breed' of human known as `cyclists' ( I am one, and a pedestrian, and a driver) is smeared with one negative brush. olafpalme
  • Score: 7

1:11pm Wed 12 Feb 14

locodogz says...

seamusl wrote:
all the voices of reason here are wasted, somre superiour attituded oaf will quote how a cyclist will jump lights or motorist will use a mobile the simple fact is that the odds are the wrong doer will get away with it, this poor young women was lucky as opposed to the cyclist who was killed by the (self admitted) sandwich eating driver, lobby your MP for the police to be given funding to do their job ie stopping the offenders of whatever type. I am attacked on my commute by yobs, villified by motorists for the simple reason I ride a bike (and yes I do obey the laws - all of them) Let us fund more police and let us stop the hate attitude, you might need somebodys help one day, will it matter whether they cycle or drive
Unfortunately your reasonable point won't influence the crackpots on either side of the 'all cyclists good, all cyclists bad' debate that rages on this site.

At the risk of straying into anecdotal territory I got a mouthful of abuse from a (fellow) cyclist two days ago. My crime? To have stopped at a zebra crossing to let someone across and thus impeded his progress.
[quote][p][bold]seamusl[/bold] wrote: all the voices of reason here are wasted, somre superiour attituded oaf will quote how a cyclist will jump lights or motorist will use a mobile the simple fact is that the odds are the wrong doer will get away with it, this poor young women was lucky as opposed to the cyclist who was killed by the (self admitted) sandwich eating driver, lobby your MP for the police to be given funding to do their job ie stopping the offenders of whatever type. I am attacked on my commute by yobs, villified by motorists for the simple reason I ride a bike (and yes I do obey the laws - all of them) Let us fund more police and let us stop the hate attitude, you might need somebodys help one day, will it matter whether they cycle or drive[/p][/quote]Unfortunately your reasonable point won't influence the crackpots on either side of the 'all cyclists good, all cyclists bad' debate that rages on this site. At the risk of straying into anecdotal territory I got a mouthful of abuse from a (fellow) cyclist two days ago. My crime? To have stopped at a zebra crossing to let someone across and thus impeded his progress. locodogz
  • Score: 16

1:21pm Wed 12 Feb 14

seamusl says...

At the risk of straying into anecdotal territory I got a mouthful of abuse from a (fellow) cyclist two days ago. My crime? To have stopped at a zebra crossing to let someone across and thus impeded his progress.

Yes, it has happened to me, I once commented to a middle aged upper looking "lady" that specs savers had a special offer on, blank stare, I then pointed out (I had caught her up after stopping myself btw) that she had gone through a red light so must need an eye test, the torrent of abuse would have blistered a dockers ears :-)
At the risk of straying into anecdotal territory I got a mouthful of abuse from a (fellow) cyclist two days ago. My crime? To have stopped at a zebra crossing to let someone across and thus impeded his progress. Yes, it has happened to me, I once commented to a middle aged upper looking "lady" that specs savers had a special offer on, blank stare, I then pointed out (I had caught her up after stopping myself btw) that she had gone through a red light so must need an eye test, the torrent of abuse would have blistered a dockers ears :-) seamusl
  • Score: 14

1:24pm Wed 12 Feb 14

dant40 says...

leaving a scene of a crash surely it's a traffic offence and hope the police will deal with this until someone is charged.

For zebra crossings that won't make any difference for some cyclists out there.
leaving a scene of a crash surely it's a traffic offence and hope the police will deal with this until someone is charged. For zebra crossings that won't make any difference for some cyclists out there. dant40
  • Score: 9

1:34pm Wed 12 Feb 14

mortimer897 says...

While cycling in Oxford a few years ago I saw a cyclist behave like this. I was riding along St Giles towards the Woodstock Road and stowed down to stop at the zebra crossing just where the road forks into Woodstock and Banbury Roads. Another cyclist overtook me, yelling "Out of my f**cking way" and road full-tilt at the crossing which had a number of pedestrians on it (maybe tourists - they all looked Japanese), causing them to scatter left and right. Had they not done so, he would have hit them.

Many years ago I witnessed a similar incident while walking along a road in Bristol - a cyclist swerved to avoid a woman with a pushchair on a zebra crossing and when he had picked himself up he started yelling and ranting, and looked as if he was about to hit the woman. Luckily my friend, who was built like a brick outhouse, restrained him until the police arrived. I never heard whether he was charged, but my friend was asked to make a statement to the police.

I fully accept that these incidents are in the minority, but there does seem to be a certain breed of cyclist (sadly, more than a few of them) who ride at full speed through occupied zebra crossings or red traffic lights as if these didn't exist or as if they don't apply to cyclists, only to motorists.

As a cyclist, I am ashamed by the behaviour or some of my fellow cyclists. I would welcome some form of official registration and number-platye to make me traceable: all the rules of the road should apply equally to cyclists and motorists, and those rules should be enforced and penalised in the same way. No-one should be exempt from the law. I always ride as if I were a human-powered car in that I obey all the same laws that I do when driving. From my own observation, I think I'm in the minority there :-(

I wish this woman a speedy recovery. I hope the cyclist is traced and prosecuted as severely as if he/she had been driving a car. But I bet he won't be traced, or if he is traced, I bet he will face a lesser charge or none at all.
While cycling in Oxford a few years ago I saw a cyclist behave like this. I was riding along St Giles towards the Woodstock Road and stowed down to stop at the zebra crossing just where the road forks into Woodstock and Banbury Roads. Another cyclist overtook me, yelling "Out of my f**cking way" and road full-tilt at the crossing which had a number of pedestrians on it (maybe tourists - they all looked Japanese), causing them to scatter left and right. Had they not done so, he would have hit them. Many years ago I witnessed a similar incident while walking along a road in Bristol - a cyclist swerved to avoid a woman with a pushchair on a zebra crossing and when he had picked himself up he started yelling and ranting, and looked as if he was about to hit the woman. Luckily my friend, who was built like a brick outhouse, restrained him until the police arrived. I never heard whether he was charged, but my friend was asked to make a statement to the police. I fully accept that these incidents are in the minority, but there does seem to be a certain breed of cyclist (sadly, more than a few of them) who ride at full speed through occupied zebra crossings or red traffic lights as if these didn't exist or as if they don't apply to cyclists, only to motorists. As a cyclist, I am ashamed by the behaviour or some of my fellow cyclists. I would welcome some form of official registration and number-platye to make me traceable: all the rules of the road should apply equally to cyclists and motorists, and those rules should be enforced and penalised in the same way. No-one should be exempt from the law. I always ride as if I were a human-powered car in that I obey all the same laws that I do when driving. From my own observation, I think I'm in the minority there :-( I wish this woman a speedy recovery. I hope the cyclist is traced and prosecuted as severely as if he/she had been driving a car. But I bet he won't be traced, or if he is traced, I bet he will face a lesser charge or none at all. mortimer897
  • Score: 24

1:37pm Wed 12 Feb 14

Madi50n says...

Funnily enough locodogz, in another anecdote, I slowed and stopped at a set of lights this morning as they had turned amber. I looked in my rear mirror in time to see the car behind me sliding nearer and nearer my bumper, stop inches from my car, then mouth obscenities at me. My crime? Having the audacity not to speed up to get through the lights so he could go through what would have been a red light.

Basically, the "all cyclists good, all cyclists bad" debate is all too frequent. The "all motorists good, all motorists bad" debate hardly ever happens.

What does happen is, 10 stories a week on drivers killing/injuring/cra
shing/breaking the law most with commenting turned off. For the few that can be commented on, there are few if any comments. Those comments that are posted tend to exonerate the driver and find fault with the victims, or make out that the driver, whilst at fault, was bound to make a mistake "we all do" and punishing them is really not on.

Then one story about a cyclist, not even a negative story sometimes, will appear with commenting most definitely turned on, and suddenly an explosion of "all cyclists bad, all cyclists good" comments appear with cyclist-haters like Dilligaf2010 admitting that they even try to hit cyclists with their car.

It's sad that the problem of thousands of injuries and deaths on our roads by a minority of motorists is ignored by the majority of people, but the problem of a few injuries on our roads by a minority of cyclists is focused on by the majority people.
Funnily enough locodogz, in another anecdote, I slowed and stopped at a set of lights this morning as they had turned amber. I looked in my rear mirror in time to see the car behind me sliding nearer and nearer my bumper, stop inches from my car, then mouth obscenities at me. My crime? Having the audacity not to speed up to get through the lights so he could go through what would have been a red light. Basically, the "all cyclists good, all cyclists bad" debate is all too frequent. The "all motorists good, all motorists bad" debate hardly ever happens. What does happen is, 10 stories a week on drivers killing/injuring/cra shing/breaking the law most with commenting turned off. For the few that can be commented on, there are few if any comments. Those comments that are posted tend to exonerate the driver and find fault with the victims, or make out that the driver, whilst at fault, was bound to make a mistake "we all do" and punishing them is really not on. Then one story about a cyclist, not even a negative story sometimes, will appear with commenting most definitely turned on, and suddenly an explosion of "all cyclists bad, all cyclists good" comments appear with cyclist-haters like Dilligaf2010 admitting that they even try to hit cyclists with their car. It's sad that the problem of thousands of injuries and deaths on our roads by a minority of motorists is ignored by the majority of people, but the problem of a few injuries on our roads by a minority of cyclists is focused on by the majority people. Madi50n
  • Score: 20

2:05pm Wed 12 Feb 14

locodogz says...

Madi50n wrote:
Funnily enough locodogz, in another anecdote, I slowed and stopped at a set of lights this morning as they had turned amber. I looked in my rear mirror in time to see the car behind me sliding nearer and nearer my bumper, stop inches from my car, then mouth obscenities at me. My crime? Having the audacity not to speed up to get through the lights so he could go through what would have been a red light.

Basically, the "all cyclists good, all cyclists bad" debate is all too frequent. The "all motorists good, all motorists bad" debate hardly ever happens.

What does happen is, 10 stories a week on drivers killing/injuring/cra

shing/breaking the law most with commenting turned off. For the few that can be commented on, there are few if any comments. Those comments that are posted tend to exonerate the driver and find fault with the victims, or make out that the driver, whilst at fault, was bound to make a mistake "we all do" and punishing them is really not on.

Then one story about a cyclist, not even a negative story sometimes, will appear with commenting most definitely turned on, and suddenly an explosion of "all cyclists bad, all cyclists good" comments appear with cyclist-haters like Dilligaf2010 admitting that they even try to hit cyclists with their car.

It's sad that the problem of thousands of injuries and deaths on our roads by a minority of motorists is ignored by the majority of people, but the problem of a few injuries on our roads by a minority of cyclists is focused on by the majority people.
Hmm not sure I really want to get into a debate with someone who seems to think that putting seven 'o's into the phrase "nooooooo idea" somehow makes their argument more valid or clever. My opinion (which I think I'm entitled to express) is that there are good and bad cyclists as there are good and bad motorist and a 'debate' as to which of the bad ones are 'more wrong' is simply futile.

To judge by the "10 stories a week on drivers killing/injuring/cra shing/breaking the law" you cite - most of these tend to contain an element of punishment for the driver - so there does at least seem to be a desire to take punitive steps against bad drivers (even if in some peoples eyes these don't go far enough)?

Unfortunately there also seem to be a handful of vociferous (if one can be vociferous on a website) idiots in each camp who simply can't see beyond their own prejudices.
[quote][p][bold]Madi50n[/bold] wrote: Funnily enough locodogz, in another anecdote, I slowed and stopped at a set of lights this morning as they had turned amber. I looked in my rear mirror in time to see the car behind me sliding nearer and nearer my bumper, stop inches from my car, then mouth obscenities at me. My crime? Having the audacity not to speed up to get through the lights so he could go through what would have been a red light. Basically, the "all cyclists good, all cyclists bad" debate is all too frequent. The "all motorists good, all motorists bad" debate hardly ever happens. What does happen is, 10 stories a week on drivers killing/injuring/cra shing/breaking the law most with commenting turned off. For the few that can be commented on, there are few if any comments. Those comments that are posted tend to exonerate the driver and find fault with the victims, or make out that the driver, whilst at fault, was bound to make a mistake "we all do" and punishing them is really not on. Then one story about a cyclist, not even a negative story sometimes, will appear with commenting most definitely turned on, and suddenly an explosion of "all cyclists bad, all cyclists good" comments appear with cyclist-haters like Dilligaf2010 admitting that they even try to hit cyclists with their car. It's sad that the problem of thousands of injuries and deaths on our roads by a minority of motorists is ignored by the majority of people, but the problem of a few injuries on our roads by a minority of cyclists is focused on by the majority people.[/p][/quote]Hmm not sure I really want to get into a debate with someone who seems to think that putting seven 'o's into the phrase "nooooooo idea" somehow makes their argument more valid or clever. My opinion (which I think I'm entitled to express) is that there are good and bad cyclists as there are good and bad motorist and a 'debate' as to which of the bad ones are 'more wrong' is simply futile. To judge by the "10 stories a week on drivers killing/injuring/cra shing/breaking the law" you cite - most of these tend to contain an element of punishment for the driver - so there does at least seem to be a desire to take punitive steps against bad drivers (even if in some peoples eyes these don't go far enough)? Unfortunately there also seem to be a handful of vociferous (if one can be vociferous on a website) idiots in each camp who simply can't see beyond their own prejudices. locodogz
  • Score: -4

2:29pm Wed 12 Feb 14

Madi50n says...

Again, I think you have misunderstood my point, you did this last time.

"My opinion (which I think I'm entitled to express) is that there are good and bad cyclists as there are good and bad motorist and a 'debate' as to which of the bad ones are 'more wrong' is simply futile."

You are correct, there are good and bad in both camps, at no stage do I say one is "more wrong" than the other. They are both wrong, neither should do it, both should be punished.

"To judge by the "10 stories a week on drivers killing/injuring/cra shing/breaking the law" you cite - most of these tend to contain an element of punishment for the driver - so there does at least seem to be a desire to take punitive steps against bad drivers (even if in some peoples eyes these don't go far enough)?"

I'm sorry, but that simply is not true, there have been a number of stories relating to crashes that have caused, delays, injury or death in the past week, with nothing relating to an element of punishment. The story simply reports an accident involving a driver or drivers. We'll probably never get a follow up report on most of those stories, whether someone gets punished or not.

http://www.oxfordmai
l.co.uk/news/1099381
5.Fourth_fatal_car_a
ccident_on_Didcot_ro
ad/

This death even has comments allowed, and yet every single one of them seems to blame the road rather than the likely cause, one of the drivers, including our cyclist hating co-commentor Livid99.

I'm hoping you don''t think I have prejudices, I was a cyclist, but gave up after the 3rd time a motorist nearly hit me with my daughter in the bike seat. I just drive now, but wish I could get back on my bike, it's healthier, cheaper & in most cases quicker.

As to the multiple os in my "nooooooo"? Unfortunately, I felt the need to be overly sarcastic with someone who thinks the mythical road tax exists and that it applies to every vehicle on the road, and seems to have entitlement issues around that belief. If my use of it means you feel you can't have a rational discussion with me, I won't lose any sleep over it.
Again, I think you have misunderstood my point, you did this last time. "My opinion (which I think I'm entitled to express) is that there are good and bad cyclists as there are good and bad motorist and a 'debate' as to which of the bad ones are 'more wrong' is simply futile." You are correct, there are good and bad in both camps, at no stage do I say one is "more wrong" than the other. They are both wrong, neither should do it, both should be punished. "To judge by the "10 stories a week on drivers killing/injuring/cra shing/breaking the law" you cite - most of these tend to contain an element of punishment for the driver - so there does at least seem to be a desire to take punitive steps against bad drivers (even if in some peoples eyes these don't go far enough)?" I'm sorry, but that simply is not true, there have been a number of stories relating to crashes that have caused, delays, injury or death in the past week, with nothing relating to an element of punishment. The story simply reports an accident involving a driver or drivers. We'll probably never get a follow up report on most of those stories, whether someone gets punished or not. http://www.oxfordmai l.co.uk/news/1099381 5.Fourth_fatal_car_a ccident_on_Didcot_ro ad/ This death even has comments allowed, and yet every single one of them seems to blame the road rather than the likely cause, one of the drivers, including our cyclist hating co-commentor Livid99. I'm hoping you don''t think I have prejudices, I was a cyclist, but gave up after the 3rd time a motorist nearly hit me with my daughter in the bike seat. I just drive now, but wish I could get back on my bike, it's healthier, cheaper & in most cases quicker. As to the multiple os in my "nooooooo"? Unfortunately, I felt the need to be overly sarcastic with someone who thinks the mythical road tax exists and that it applies to every vehicle on the road, and seems to have entitlement issues around that belief. If my use of it means you feel you can't have a rational discussion with me, I won't lose any sleep over it. Madi50n
  • Score: 10

2:52pm Wed 12 Feb 14

grandconjuration says...

Madi50n wrote:
Funnily enough locodogz, in another anecdote, I slowed and stopped at a set of lights this morning as they had turned amber. I looked in my rear mirror in time to see the car behind me sliding nearer and nearer my bumper, stop inches from my car, then mouth obscenities at me. My crime? Having the audacity not to speed up to get through the lights so he could go through what would have been a red light.

Basically, the "all cyclists good, all cyclists bad" debate is all too frequent. The "all motorists good, all motorists bad" debate hardly ever happens.

What does happen is, 10 stories a week on drivers killing/injuring/cra

shing/breaking the law most with commenting turned off. For the few that can be commented on, there are few if any comments. Those comments that are posted tend to exonerate the driver and find fault with the victims, or make out that the driver, whilst at fault, was bound to make a mistake "we all do" and punishing them is really not on.

Then one story about a cyclist, not even a negative story sometimes, will appear with commenting most definitely turned on, and suddenly an explosion of "all cyclists bad, all cyclists good" comments appear with cyclist-haters like Dilligaf2010 admitting that they even try to hit cyclists with their car.

It's sad that the problem of thousands of injuries and deaths on our roads by a minority of motorists is ignored by the majority of people, but the problem of a few injuries on our roads by a minority of cyclists is focused on by the majority people.
An excellent comment, the best on this thread so far.
[quote][p][bold]Madi50n[/bold] wrote: Funnily enough locodogz, in another anecdote, I slowed and stopped at a set of lights this morning as they had turned amber. I looked in my rear mirror in time to see the car behind me sliding nearer and nearer my bumper, stop inches from my car, then mouth obscenities at me. My crime? Having the audacity not to speed up to get through the lights so he could go through what would have been a red light. Basically, the "all cyclists good, all cyclists bad" debate is all too frequent. The "all motorists good, all motorists bad" debate hardly ever happens. What does happen is, 10 stories a week on drivers killing/injuring/cra shing/breaking the law most with commenting turned off. For the few that can be commented on, there are few if any comments. Those comments that are posted tend to exonerate the driver and find fault with the victims, or make out that the driver, whilst at fault, was bound to make a mistake "we all do" and punishing them is really not on. Then one story about a cyclist, not even a negative story sometimes, will appear with commenting most definitely turned on, and suddenly an explosion of "all cyclists bad, all cyclists good" comments appear with cyclist-haters like Dilligaf2010 admitting that they even try to hit cyclists with their car. It's sad that the problem of thousands of injuries and deaths on our roads by a minority of motorists is ignored by the majority of people, but the problem of a few injuries on our roads by a minority of cyclists is focused on by the majority people.[/p][/quote]An excellent comment, the best on this thread so far. grandconjuration
  • Score: 13

3:48pm Wed 12 Feb 14

olafpalme says...

I suspect if there was as much bike shop/cycling advertisement income at the Oxford Mail, as there is/instead of, car advertising, the specific comments section opening and reporting emphasis might be reversed!
I suspect if there was as much bike shop/cycling advertisement income at the Oxford Mail, as there is/instead of, car advertising, the specific comments section opening and reporting emphasis might be reversed! olafpalme
  • Score: 4

9:00pm Wed 12 Feb 14

Interestedinoxford says...

Cyclists in Oxford are out of the control. I was hit on the pavement and received a load of abuse when I pointed out that the cyclist should not have been there.
I have to say that the police are too lenient on cyclists in Oxford e.g., no lights,just get them them fitted and we'll say no more. Just prosecute offenders equally.
Cyclists in Oxford are out of the control. I was hit on the pavement and received a load of abuse when I pointed out that the cyclist should not have been there. I have to say that the police are too lenient on cyclists in Oxford e.g., no lights,just get them them fitted and we'll say no more. Just prosecute offenders equally. Interestedinoxford
  • Score: 3

9:52pm Wed 12 Feb 14

Madi50n says...

3 driver related stories on the OM news page right now, 2 crashes you can't comment on, 1 about drivers ignoring road closures with 3 comments one of which even says drivers shouldn't be blamed for ignoring signs.

Yep, The daily mail and it's readers really don't have an anti-cycling agenda.

Did I say Daily? I meant Oxford...;-)
3 driver related stories on the OM news page right now, 2 crashes you can't comment on, 1 about drivers ignoring road closures with 3 comments one of which even says drivers shouldn't be blamed for ignoring signs. Yep, The daily mail and it's readers really don't have an anti-cycling agenda. Did I say Daily? I meant Oxford...;-) Madi50n
  • Score: 3

9:53pm Wed 12 Feb 14

Madi50n says...

****! Its, its, its.
****! Its, its, its. Madi50n
  • Score: 1

7:37am Thu 13 Feb 14

livid99 says...

Madi50n wrote:
Have emailed OM & TVP about Dilligaf2010's admission of attempting to deliberately hit a cyclist with his car.

Thanks to him for proving the point, that some people hate cyclists so much they will attempt to kill them.

Hello Livid, see your usual tripe in these comments, boooooring, every single one of these tired, tired exhausted cliches is so old it's stopped being funny that people are so dumb they think they are true.

Same old people writing the same rubbish who said absolutely nothing about the recent deaths caused by cars on local roads recently. Want to know why? Because I do, I'd love to know why they are so unbelievably incensed by the occasional cyclist causing an accident but say absolutely nothing on the regular stories about deaths caused by motorists.

Unfortunately, we'll never know why, they won't even admit it they hate cyclists and love the motorists out there killing on a daily basis.
Was waiting for you to appear with your attempts to divert the story onto accidents involving cars. You are as boring and predictable as I am matey.
What speaks volumes here is that there are people like you who are willing to jump in and attack any comments against cyclists. Did you actually read this story ?? A cyclist jumped a red light and injured a pedestrian. Do you condemn the actions of this cyclist ? Or do you just condemn comments from me while trying your best to distract people with your diversionary tactics about motorists again ? This girl has been badly hurt, but I see no criticism from you of the cyclist involved. Thats all I need to know about you.
[quote][p][bold]Madi50n[/bold] wrote: Have emailed OM & TVP about Dilligaf2010's admission of attempting to deliberately hit a cyclist with his car. Thanks to him for proving the point, that some people hate cyclists so much they will attempt to kill them. Hello Livid, see your usual tripe in these comments, boooooring, every single one of these tired, tired exhausted cliches is so old it's stopped being funny that people are so dumb they think they are true. Same old people writing the same rubbish who said absolutely nothing about the recent deaths caused by cars on local roads recently. Want to know why? Because I do, I'd love to know why they are so unbelievably incensed by the occasional cyclist causing an accident but say absolutely nothing on the regular stories about deaths caused by motorists. Unfortunately, we'll never know why, they won't even admit it they hate cyclists and love the motorists out there killing on a daily basis.[/p][/quote]Was waiting for you to appear with your attempts to divert the story onto accidents involving cars. You are as boring and predictable as I am matey. What speaks volumes here is that there are people like you who are willing to jump in and attack any comments against cyclists. Did you actually read this story ?? A cyclist jumped a red light and injured a pedestrian. Do you condemn the actions of this cyclist ? Or do you just condemn comments from me while trying your best to distract people with your diversionary tactics about motorists again ? This girl has been badly hurt, but I see no criticism from you of the cyclist involved. Thats all I need to know about you. livid99
  • Score: -5

7:45am Thu 13 Feb 14

livid99 says...

Deadwoodward wrote:
Just because motorists do stupid things, it does not stop us criticising cyclists who go whizzing through red lights. It is stupid, dangerous, illegal.
Exactly, but the arrogance and apparent inability to criticise other cyclists by some here makes it appear that jumping red lights and injuring someone is stupid, dangerous and illegal only if done by motorists, not cyclists. Then if we criticisie them we are called anti-cycling trolls.
[quote][p][bold]Deadwoodward[/bold] wrote: Just because motorists do stupid things, it does not stop us criticising cyclists who go whizzing through red lights. It is stupid, dangerous, illegal.[/p][/quote]Exactly, but the arrogance and apparent inability to criticise other cyclists by some here makes it appear that jumping red lights and injuring someone is stupid, dangerous and illegal only if done by motorists, not cyclists. Then if we criticisie them we are called anti-cycling trolls. livid99
  • Score: -1

8:38am Thu 13 Feb 14

Wanchai says...

livid99 wrote:
Deadwoodward wrote:
Just because motorists do stupid things, it does not stop us criticising cyclists who go whizzing through red lights. It is stupid, dangerous, illegal.
Exactly, but the arrogance and apparent inability to criticise other cyclists by some here makes it appear that jumping red lights and injuring someone is stupid, dangerous and illegal only if done by motorists, not cyclists. Then if we criticisie them we are called anti-cycling trolls.
Dilligaf2010 commented earlier about using a car as a weapon against cyclists - and it appears that you were unable to criticise that.

There's something very wrong with a certain section of drivers in Oxford. You sense it every time you take a bike out in this city. They are the ones on your tail, desperate to squeeze past, even when they know they will be stopping again in the next few metres.

Nobody here is defending the actions of the cyclist in the original story.
[quote][p][bold]livid99[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Deadwoodward[/bold] wrote: Just because motorists do stupid things, it does not stop us criticising cyclists who go whizzing through red lights. It is stupid, dangerous, illegal.[/p][/quote]Exactly, but the arrogance and apparent inability to criticise other cyclists by some here makes it appear that jumping red lights and injuring someone is stupid, dangerous and illegal only if done by motorists, not cyclists. Then if we criticisie them we are called anti-cycling trolls.[/p][/quote]Dilligaf2010 commented earlier about using a car as a weapon against cyclists - and it appears that you were unable to criticise that. There's something very wrong with a certain section of drivers in Oxford. You sense it every time you take a bike out in this city. They are the ones on your tail, desperate to squeeze past, even when they know they will be stopping again in the next few metres. Nobody here is defending the actions of the cyclist in the original story. Wanchai
  • Score: 4

8:45am Thu 13 Feb 14

livid99 says...

Wanchai wrote:
livid99 wrote:
Deadwoodward wrote:
Just because motorists do stupid things, it does not stop us criticising cyclists who go whizzing through red lights. It is stupid, dangerous, illegal.
Exactly, but the arrogance and apparent inability to criticise other cyclists by some here makes it appear that jumping red lights and injuring someone is stupid, dangerous and illegal only if done by motorists, not cyclists. Then if we criticisie them we are called anti-cycling trolls.
Dilligaf2010 commented earlier about using a car as a weapon against cyclists - and it appears that you were unable to criticise that.

There's something very wrong with a certain section of drivers in Oxford. You sense it every time you take a bike out in this city. They are the ones on your tail, desperate to squeeze past, even when they know they will be stopping again in the next few metres.

Nobody here is defending the actions of the cyclist in the original story.
If Dilligaf2010 is being serious, then of course I condemn it.
[quote][p][bold]Wanchai[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]livid99[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Deadwoodward[/bold] wrote: Just because motorists do stupid things, it does not stop us criticising cyclists who go whizzing through red lights. It is stupid, dangerous, illegal.[/p][/quote]Exactly, but the arrogance and apparent inability to criticise other cyclists by some here makes it appear that jumping red lights and injuring someone is stupid, dangerous and illegal only if done by motorists, not cyclists. Then if we criticisie them we are called anti-cycling trolls.[/p][/quote]Dilligaf2010 commented earlier about using a car as a weapon against cyclists - and it appears that you were unable to criticise that. There's something very wrong with a certain section of drivers in Oxford. You sense it every time you take a bike out in this city. They are the ones on your tail, desperate to squeeze past, even when they know they will be stopping again in the next few metres. Nobody here is defending the actions of the cyclist in the original story.[/p][/quote]If Dilligaf2010 is being serious, then of course I condemn it. livid99
  • Score: 5

9:12am Thu 13 Feb 14

Madi50n says...

livid99 wrote:
Madi50n wrote:
Have emailed OM & TVP about Dilligaf2010's admission of attempting to deliberately hit a cyclist with his car.

Thanks to him for proving the point, that some people hate cyclists so much they will attempt to kill them.

Hello Livid, see your usual tripe in these comments, boooooring, every single one of these tired, tired exhausted cliches is so old it's stopped being funny that people are so dumb they think they are true.

Same old people writing the same rubbish who said absolutely nothing about the recent deaths caused by cars on local roads recently. Want to know why? Because I do, I'd love to know why they are so unbelievably incensed by the occasional cyclist causing an accident but say absolutely nothing on the regular stories about deaths caused by motorists.

Unfortunately, we'll never know why, they won't even admit it they hate cyclists and love the motorists out there killing on a daily basis.
Was waiting for you to appear with your attempts to divert the story onto accidents involving cars. You are as boring and predictable as I am matey.
What speaks volumes here is that there are people like you who are willing to jump in and attack any comments against cyclists. Did you actually read this story ?? A cyclist jumped a red light and injured a pedestrian. Do you condemn the actions of this cyclist ? Or do you just condemn comments from me while trying your best to distract people with your diversionary tactics about motorists again ? This girl has been badly hurt, but I see no criticism from you of the cyclist involved. Thats all I need to know about you.
Once again Livid you have failed dismally to get the point, this is the last time, OK? If you continue to fail to see the point then I will just give up.

Cyclists do stupid things, they do dangerous things, the cyclist in this story, whoever he or she may be is a moron and deserves to caught and punished. Got that? Understand?

Now, the point I am constantly trying to make, which seems to bypass you or gets translated into me and others like me defending cyclists is this.

You and people like you don't comment on stories about motorists causing accidents, and if you ever do, you never ever criticise the motorists. The death on the road involving motorists outside didcot 6 days ago has a comment from you, and I quote:

"That stretch really is a scary bit of road to drive on. Some proper work to repair some of the atrocious holes and erosion along the edge of the road would make it much safer. In some places the choice is between swerving towards oncoming traffic, or hitting a car-breaking hole."

Not a single word about the drivers from you Livid99, not one.

And yet, on stories about cyclists, even ones where how cyclists are trying to be safer, or pointing out that someone making an illegal left turn put a cyclists in danger, you, and others like you, always pitch in with "Cyclists are dangerous, cyclists are etc..

I refer to my earlier paragraph, come cyclists do stupid and dangerous things, and the poor girl in this story is the victim of a moron who should be punished. Not one single person on this thread has said otherwise.

So please, tell me, why exactly is it that these stories generate such generalised anti-cyclist sentiment from people like you. Whereas stories about motorists killing each other generate sympathetic comments blaming anything but the drivers?

Answer that question, if you can. I doubt you will, you'll just try and and deliberately misunderstand the point and say I'm trying to condone the cyclist. I'm not, I condemn his/her actions. You on the other hand, condemn cyclists and condone motorists.
[quote][p][bold]livid99[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Madi50n[/bold] wrote: Have emailed OM & TVP about Dilligaf2010's admission of attempting to deliberately hit a cyclist with his car. Thanks to him for proving the point, that some people hate cyclists so much they will attempt to kill them. Hello Livid, see your usual tripe in these comments, boooooring, every single one of these tired, tired exhausted cliches is so old it's stopped being funny that people are so dumb they think they are true. Same old people writing the same rubbish who said absolutely nothing about the recent deaths caused by cars on local roads recently. Want to know why? Because I do, I'd love to know why they are so unbelievably incensed by the occasional cyclist causing an accident but say absolutely nothing on the regular stories about deaths caused by motorists. Unfortunately, we'll never know why, they won't even admit it they hate cyclists and love the motorists out there killing on a daily basis.[/p][/quote]Was waiting for you to appear with your attempts to divert the story onto accidents involving cars. You are as boring and predictable as I am matey. What speaks volumes here is that there are people like you who are willing to jump in and attack any comments against cyclists. Did you actually read this story ?? A cyclist jumped a red light and injured a pedestrian. Do you condemn the actions of this cyclist ? Or do you just condemn comments from me while trying your best to distract people with your diversionary tactics about motorists again ? This girl has been badly hurt, but I see no criticism from you of the cyclist involved. Thats all I need to know about you.[/p][/quote]Once again Livid you have failed dismally to get the point, this is the last time, OK? If you continue to fail to see the point then I will just give up. Cyclists do stupid things, they do dangerous things, the cyclist in this story, whoever he or she may be is a moron and deserves to caught and punished. Got that? Understand? Now, the point I am constantly trying to make, which seems to bypass you or gets translated into me and others like me defending cyclists is this. You and people like you don't comment on stories about motorists causing accidents, and if you ever do, you never ever criticise the motorists. The death on the road involving motorists outside didcot 6 days ago has a comment from you, and I quote: "That stretch really is a scary bit of road to drive on. Some proper work to repair some of the atrocious holes and erosion along the edge of the road would make it much safer. In some places the choice is between swerving towards oncoming traffic, or hitting a car-breaking hole." Not a single word about the drivers from you Livid99, not one. And yet, on stories about cyclists, even ones where how cyclists are trying to be safer, or pointing out that someone making an illegal left turn put a cyclists in danger, you, and others like you, always pitch in with "Cyclists are dangerous, cyclists are [insert standard anti-cyclist claptrap here] etc.. I refer to my earlier paragraph, come cyclists do stupid and dangerous things, and the poor girl in this story is the victim of a moron who should be punished. Not one single person on this thread has said otherwise. So please, tell me, why exactly is it that these stories generate such generalised anti-cyclist sentiment from people like you. Whereas stories about motorists killing each other generate sympathetic comments blaming anything but the drivers? Answer that question, if you can. I doubt you will, you'll just try and and deliberately misunderstand the point and say I'm trying to condone the cyclist. I'm not, I condemn his/her actions. You on the other hand, condemn cyclists and condone motorists. Madi50n
  • Score: 4

9:37am Thu 13 Feb 14

dovepe says...

Hi vis jackets lights on bikes not on person should be made law.Taxi drivers are just as bad going through red lights and doing u turns,
:-)
Hi vis jackets lights on bikes not on person should be made law.Taxi drivers are just as bad going through red lights and doing u turns, :-) dovepe
  • Score: 2

9:42am Thu 13 Feb 14

livid99 says...

Madi50n wrote:
livid99 wrote:
Madi50n wrote:
Have emailed OM & TVP about Dilligaf2010's admission of attempting to deliberately hit a cyclist with his car.

Thanks to him for proving the point, that some people hate cyclists so much they will attempt to kill them.

Hello Livid, see your usual tripe in these comments, boooooring, every single one of these tired, tired exhausted cliches is so old it's stopped being funny that people are so dumb they think they are true.

Same old people writing the same rubbish who said absolutely nothing about the recent deaths caused by cars on local roads recently. Want to know why? Because I do, I'd love to know why they are so unbelievably incensed by the occasional cyclist causing an accident but say absolutely nothing on the regular stories about deaths caused by motorists.

Unfortunately, we'll never know why, they won't even admit it they hate cyclists and love the motorists out there killing on a daily basis.
Was waiting for you to appear with your attempts to divert the story onto accidents involving cars. You are as boring and predictable as I am matey.
What speaks volumes here is that there are people like you who are willing to jump in and attack any comments against cyclists. Did you actually read this story ?? A cyclist jumped a red light and injured a pedestrian. Do you condemn the actions of this cyclist ? Or do you just condemn comments from me while trying your best to distract people with your diversionary tactics about motorists again ? This girl has been badly hurt, but I see no criticism from you of the cyclist involved. Thats all I need to know about you.
Once again Livid you have failed dismally to get the point, this is the last time, OK? If you continue to fail to see the point then I will just give up.

Cyclists do stupid things, they do dangerous things, the cyclist in this story, whoever he or she may be is a moron and deserves to caught and punished. Got that? Understand?

Now, the point I am constantly trying to make, which seems to bypass you or gets translated into me and others like me defending cyclists is this.

You and people like you don't comment on stories about motorists causing accidents, and if you ever do, you never ever criticise the motorists. The death on the road involving motorists outside didcot 6 days ago has a comment from you, and I quote:

"That stretch really is a scary bit of road to drive on. Some proper work to repair some of the atrocious holes and erosion along the edge of the road would make it much safer. In some places the choice is between swerving towards oncoming traffic, or hitting a car-breaking hole."

Not a single word about the drivers from you Livid99, not one.

And yet, on stories about cyclists, even ones where how cyclists are trying to be safer, or pointing out that someone making an illegal left turn put a cyclists in danger, you, and others like you, always pitch in with "Cyclists are dangerous, cyclists are etc..

I refer to my earlier paragraph, come cyclists do stupid and dangerous things, and the poor girl in this story is the victim of a moron who should be punished. Not one single person on this thread has said otherwise.

So please, tell me, why exactly is it that these stories generate such generalised anti-cyclist sentiment from people like you. Whereas stories about motorists killing each other generate sympathetic comments blaming anything but the drivers?

Answer that question, if you can. I doubt you will, you'll just try and and deliberately misunderstand the point and say I'm trying to condone the cyclist. I'm not, I condemn his/her actions. You on the other hand, condemn cyclists and condone motorists.
Regarding the fatal accident near Wallingford - Quote"Not a single word about the drivers from you Livid99, not one." That is because the accident was due to the appalling state of that piece of road !! Why should I say anything about the drivers when it was caused by the road conditions ?? I don't see any comment on the drivers from you either, which is surprising considering your constant complaining about the lack of criticism ???
I perfectly understand what you are trying to do, and your patronising tone does not go un-noticed. You just appear to be one of those people who tries to win arguments by attempting to make others appear stupid. You do it in most of your replies.
I am not the only person who criticises cyclists in Oxford, and I will continue to do so while they continue to break the law. Meanwhile, you feel free to criticise motorist in any topic about motorist breaking the law if you so wish.
[quote][p][bold]Madi50n[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]livid99[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Madi50n[/bold] wrote: Have emailed OM & TVP about Dilligaf2010's admission of attempting to deliberately hit a cyclist with his car. Thanks to him for proving the point, that some people hate cyclists so much they will attempt to kill them. Hello Livid, see your usual tripe in these comments, boooooring, every single one of these tired, tired exhausted cliches is so old it's stopped being funny that people are so dumb they think they are true. Same old people writing the same rubbish who said absolutely nothing about the recent deaths caused by cars on local roads recently. Want to know why? Because I do, I'd love to know why they are so unbelievably incensed by the occasional cyclist causing an accident but say absolutely nothing on the regular stories about deaths caused by motorists. Unfortunately, we'll never know why, they won't even admit it they hate cyclists and love the motorists out there killing on a daily basis.[/p][/quote]Was waiting for you to appear with your attempts to divert the story onto accidents involving cars. You are as boring and predictable as I am matey. What speaks volumes here is that there are people like you who are willing to jump in and attack any comments against cyclists. Did you actually read this story ?? A cyclist jumped a red light and injured a pedestrian. Do you condemn the actions of this cyclist ? Or do you just condemn comments from me while trying your best to distract people with your diversionary tactics about motorists again ? This girl has been badly hurt, but I see no criticism from you of the cyclist involved. Thats all I need to know about you.[/p][/quote]Once again Livid you have failed dismally to get the point, this is the last time, OK? If you continue to fail to see the point then I will just give up. Cyclists do stupid things, they do dangerous things, the cyclist in this story, whoever he or she may be is a moron and deserves to caught and punished. Got that? Understand? Now, the point I am constantly trying to make, which seems to bypass you or gets translated into me and others like me defending cyclists is this. You and people like you don't comment on stories about motorists causing accidents, and if you ever do, you never ever criticise the motorists. The death on the road involving motorists outside didcot 6 days ago has a comment from you, and I quote: "That stretch really is a scary bit of road to drive on. Some proper work to repair some of the atrocious holes and erosion along the edge of the road would make it much safer. In some places the choice is between swerving towards oncoming traffic, or hitting a car-breaking hole." Not a single word about the drivers from you Livid99, not one. And yet, on stories about cyclists, even ones where how cyclists are trying to be safer, or pointing out that someone making an illegal left turn put a cyclists in danger, you, and others like you, always pitch in with "Cyclists are dangerous, cyclists are [insert standard anti-cyclist claptrap here] etc.. I refer to my earlier paragraph, come cyclists do stupid and dangerous things, and the poor girl in this story is the victim of a moron who should be punished. Not one single person on this thread has said otherwise. So please, tell me, why exactly is it that these stories generate such generalised anti-cyclist sentiment from people like you. Whereas stories about motorists killing each other generate sympathetic comments blaming anything but the drivers? Answer that question, if you can. I doubt you will, you'll just try and and deliberately misunderstand the point and say I'm trying to condone the cyclist. I'm not, I condemn his/her actions. You on the other hand, condemn cyclists and condone motorists.[/p][/quote]Regarding the fatal accident near Wallingford - Quote"Not a single word about the drivers from you Livid99, not one." That is because the accident was due to the appalling state of that piece of road !! Why should I say anything about the drivers when it was caused by the road conditions ?? I don't see any comment on the drivers from you either, which is surprising considering your constant complaining about the lack of criticism ??? I perfectly understand what you are trying to do, and your patronising tone does not go un-noticed. You just appear to be one of those people who tries to win arguments by attempting to make others appear stupid. You do it in most of your replies. I am not the only person who criticises cyclists in Oxford, and I will continue to do so while they continue to break the law. Meanwhile, you feel free to criticise motorist in any topic about motorist breaking the law if you so wish. livid99
  • Score: -2

9:47am Thu 13 Feb 14

Madi50n says...

I'm not attempting to make you appear stupid livid, you're doing a perfectly good job of that yourself.

Bored of you now, given up.
I'm not attempting to make you appear stupid livid, you're doing a perfectly good job of that yourself. Bored of you now, given up. Madi50n
  • Score: 1

9:51am Thu 13 Feb 14

livid99 says...

Madi50n wrote:
I'm not attempting to make you appear stupid livid, you're doing a perfectly good job of that yourself.

Bored of you now, given up.
Haha....so no actual comments on my reply as expected. You need to look at some of nonsense you write before saying things like that pal.
Out
[quote][p][bold]Madi50n[/bold] wrote: I'm not attempting to make you appear stupid livid, you're doing a perfectly good job of that yourself. Bored of you now, given up.[/p][/quote]Haha....so no actual comments on my reply as expected. You need to look at some of nonsense you write before saying things like that pal. Out livid99
  • Score: -12

12:03pm Thu 13 Feb 14

locodogz says...

Madi50n wrote:
Again, I think you have misunderstood my point, you did this last time.

"My opinion (which I think I'm entitled to express) is that there are good and bad cyclists as there are good and bad motorist and a 'debate' as to which of the bad ones are 'more wrong' is simply futile."

You are correct, there are good and bad in both camps, at no stage do I say one is "more wrong" than the other. They are both wrong, neither should do it, both should be punished.

"To judge by the "10 stories a week on drivers killing/injuring/cra shing/breaking the law" you cite - most of these tend to contain an element of punishment for the driver - so there does at least seem to be a desire to take punitive steps against bad drivers (even if in some peoples eyes these don't go far enough)?"

I'm sorry, but that simply is not true, there have been a number of stories relating to crashes that have caused, delays, injury or death in the past week, with nothing relating to an element of punishment. The story simply reports an accident involving a driver or drivers. We'll probably never get a follow up report on most of those stories, whether someone gets punished or not.

http://www.oxfordmai

l.co.uk/news/1099381

5.Fourth_fatal_car_a

ccident_on_Didcot_ro

ad/

This death even has comments allowed, and yet every single one of them seems to blame the road rather than the likely cause, one of the drivers, including our cyclist hating co-commentor Livid99.

I'm hoping you don''t think I have prejudices, I was a cyclist, but gave up after the 3rd time a motorist nearly hit me with my daughter in the bike seat. I just drive now, but wish I could get back on my bike, it's healthier, cheaper & in most cases quicker.

As to the multiple os in my "nooooooo"? Unfortunately, I felt the need to be overly sarcastic with someone who thinks the mythical road tax exists and that it applies to every vehicle on the road, and seems to have entitlement issues around that belief. If my use of it means you feel you can't have a rational discussion with me, I won't lose any sleep over it.
You do know what they say about sarcasm don't you?

So you pick a story which specifically says that the cause of the crash is yet to be established to illustrate that it contains "nothing relating to punishment"? Surely you understand that maybe the police (who according to the story are investigating) might want to establish the facts before dishing out any punishment? If it helps redress the balance do read this weeks 'Scales of Justice" piece which at a quick count mentions 9 individuals convicted (yes – that’s punished) for motoring offences.

Interesting when it comes to facts you seem to have utter disdain for any of those who suggest – on the story you cite - that the road surface may have been a factor rather than (your opinion) of "the likely cause, one of the drivers" - an utter supposition on your part?

On a separate note, whilst I can quite understand your rationale for giving it up, I do hope you manage to get out again on your bike at some point for all the good reasons you list.
[quote][p][bold]Madi50n[/bold] wrote: Again, I think you have misunderstood my point, you did this last time. "My opinion (which I think I'm entitled to express) is that there are good and bad cyclists as there are good and bad motorist and a 'debate' as to which of the bad ones are 'more wrong' is simply futile." You are correct, there are good and bad in both camps, at no stage do I say one is "more wrong" than the other. They are both wrong, neither should do it, both should be punished. "To judge by the "10 stories a week on drivers killing/injuring/cra shing/breaking the law" you cite - most of these tend to contain an element of punishment for the driver - so there does at least seem to be a desire to take punitive steps against bad drivers (even if in some peoples eyes these don't go far enough)?" I'm sorry, but that simply is not true, there have been a number of stories relating to crashes that have caused, delays, injury or death in the past week, with nothing relating to an element of punishment. The story simply reports an accident involving a driver or drivers. We'll probably never get a follow up report on most of those stories, whether someone gets punished or not. http://www.oxfordmai l.co.uk/news/1099381 5.Fourth_fatal_car_a ccident_on_Didcot_ro ad/ This death even has comments allowed, and yet every single one of them seems to blame the road rather than the likely cause, one of the drivers, including our cyclist hating co-commentor Livid99. I'm hoping you don''t think I have prejudices, I was a cyclist, but gave up after the 3rd time a motorist nearly hit me with my daughter in the bike seat. I just drive now, but wish I could get back on my bike, it's healthier, cheaper & in most cases quicker. As to the multiple os in my "nooooooo"? Unfortunately, I felt the need to be overly sarcastic with someone who thinks the mythical road tax exists and that it applies to every vehicle on the road, and seems to have entitlement issues around that belief. If my use of it means you feel you can't have a rational discussion with me, I won't lose any sleep over it.[/p][/quote]You do know what they say about sarcasm don't you? So you pick a story which specifically says that the cause of the crash is yet to be established to illustrate that it contains "nothing relating to punishment"? Surely you understand that maybe the police (who according to the story are investigating) might want to establish the facts before dishing out any punishment? If it helps redress the balance do read this weeks 'Scales of Justice" piece which at a quick count mentions 9 individuals convicted (yes – that’s punished) for motoring offences. Interesting when it comes to facts you seem to have utter disdain for any of those who suggest – on the story you cite - that the road surface may have been a factor rather than (your opinion) of "the likely cause, one of the drivers" - an utter supposition on your part? On a separate note, whilst I can quite understand your rationale for giving it up, I do hope you manage to get out again on your bike at some point for all the good reasons you list. locodogz
  • Score: -1

1:20pm Thu 13 Feb 14

E'beth says...

I will agree that the junction itself is a problem; although I am not sure what to suggest that would be an improvement. I've used it as both a pedestrian and a cyclist. Cycling up George St, there appears to be a long period of time when the lights are red, but it is generally safe for pedestrians to cross with care. But, when the lights finally go green the pedestrians don't notice ... I finally worked out that part of the difficulty is that they cannot see the lights pertaining to the traffic waiting to exit George St, I know that if I want to cross against a red light I try to see the traffic lights as well to judge when it may be safe. Also, I think that the traffic light for vehicles wanting to exit Cornmarket may also go green in every cycle - the junction might be better used if that was switched off during the day when vehicles can't use Cornmarket ...
I will agree that the junction itself is a problem; although I am not sure what to suggest that would be an improvement. I've used it as both a pedestrian and a cyclist. Cycling up George St, there appears to be a long period of time when the lights are red, but it is generally safe for pedestrians to cross with care. But, when the lights finally go green the pedestrians don't notice ... I finally worked out that part of the difficulty is that they cannot see the lights pertaining to the traffic waiting to exit George St, I know that if I want to cross against a red light I try to see the traffic lights as well to judge when it may be safe. Also, I think that the traffic light for vehicles wanting to exit Cornmarket may also go green in every cycle - the junction might be better used if that was switched off during the day when vehicles can't use Cornmarket ... E'beth
  • Score: 6

2:12pm Thu 13 Feb 14

seamusl says...

"You do know what they say about sarcasm don't you?

Sarcasm may be the lowest form of wit (sic) but tis better than being witless.

Chris Boardman in todays Guardian expressed surprise that although British Cycling has made our country the amazing success it is at cycle sport (Olymics, Tour de France etc) there is no acceptance of cycling as a mode of transport by the masses, I would suggest the pathological attitude to the humble cycle by some of the general public is what needs to be sorted along with the acceptance that some of each type of transport user is a right pillock ignoring the laws not ALL. This will fall on (some ) deaf ears but I do find it sad that people have to be so **** vitriolic, there must be something sadly lacking to have such venom splurt forth. However the Oxford Mail has done it again and bought this diabolical attitude to the comments page attention, be careful out there ALL of you, there are some truly nasty folk about.
"You do know what they say about sarcasm don't you? Sarcasm may be the lowest form of wit (sic) but tis better than being witless. Chris Boardman in todays Guardian expressed surprise that although British Cycling has made our country the amazing success it is at cycle sport (Olymics, Tour de France etc) there is no acceptance of cycling as a mode of transport by the masses, I would suggest the pathological attitude to the humble cycle by some of the general public is what needs to be sorted along with the acceptance that some of each type of transport user is a right pillock ignoring the laws not ALL. This will fall on (some ) deaf ears but I do find it sad that people have to be so **** vitriolic, there must be something sadly lacking to have such venom splurt forth. However the Oxford Mail has done it again and bought this diabolical attitude to the comments page attention, be careful out there ALL of you, there are some truly nasty folk about. seamusl
  • Score: 7

1:47pm Fri 14 Feb 14

seamusl says...

Two cyclists dead after being hit by a black bmw after going out of control after hitting a lamp post (possibly being pursued by police) at Purley, of course the bmw driver MUST have been obeying the law, most probably the cyclists fault for daring to be on the road. This appears to be the mode of thought of the anti cyclist brigade. Bitter ? you bet I am. I am scared (expletive deleted), I shouldn't have to feel as though my life/personal safety is on the line as I cycle to work. I obey ALL the laws even stopping at red lights in the wee hours when nothing else is about, I am lit like a Christmas tree even in overcast light or dodgey weather yet as I head out to work in a short while (yes I ride all year round) I am so so nervous. Right I have had my rant, let us enjoy life and be a little more forgiving to each other, those two poor cyclists deserve that as a memorial.
Seamus
Two cyclists dead after being hit by a black bmw after going out of control after hitting a lamp post (possibly being pursued by police) at Purley, of course the bmw driver MUST have been obeying the law, most probably the cyclists fault for daring to be on the road. This appears to be the mode of thought of the anti cyclist brigade. Bitter ? you bet I am. I am scared (expletive deleted), I shouldn't have to feel as though my life/personal safety is on the line as I cycle to work. I obey ALL the laws even stopping at red lights in the wee hours when nothing else is about, I am lit like a Christmas tree even in overcast light or dodgey weather yet as I head out to work in a short while (yes I ride all year round) I am so so nervous. Right I have had my rant, let us enjoy life and be a little more forgiving to each other, those two poor cyclists deserve that as a memorial. Seamus seamusl
  • Score: 19

2:07pm Fri 14 Feb 14

damnfool says...

I would like to ask the cyclist who ran the Red Light if they would do the same thing a whilst driving a car, I am willing to bet the answer would be no.

I would then ask them what they perceive the difference to be? And watch them scramble to come up with a logical answer.
I would like to ask the cyclist who ran the Red Light if they would do the same thing a whilst driving a car, I am willing to bet the answer would be no. I would then ask them what they perceive the difference to be? And watch them scramble to come up with a logical answer. damnfool
  • Score: 0

2:48pm Fri 14 Feb 14

seamusl says...

Actually on my commute there is a light controlled t junction by Kidlington library/the chemist, I on the main road see my lights change to green while usually two or three cars continue through their red light, not once or twice but 90% plus of the time. I do not condone any law breaking but at least remember these people are disregarding the law in around a ton of lethal weapon while a cycle jumping a red light would come off worse in a collision with a vehicle. There is no difference, you are a law breaker doing that. A few years ago a car knocked me off a solo cycle, they were completely at fault as all the witnesses stated (including an ex police man) he was given a choice, prosecution or pay for a driver awareness course, why can they not make a cyclist pay for a road awareness course with cycle safety included, hit someone in the pocket and they usually pay attention and hopefully we will get better road users out of it
Actually on my commute there is a light controlled t junction by Kidlington library/the chemist, I on the main road see my lights change to green while usually two or three cars continue through their red light, not once or twice but 90% plus of the time. I do not condone any law breaking but at least remember these people are disregarding the law in around a ton of lethal weapon while a cycle jumping a red light would come off worse in a collision with a vehicle. There is no difference, you are a law breaker doing that. A few years ago a car knocked me off a solo cycle, they were completely at fault as all the witnesses stated (including an ex police man) he was given a choice, prosecution or pay for a driver awareness course, why can they not make a cyclist pay for a road awareness course with cycle safety included, hit someone in the pocket and they usually pay attention and hopefully we will get better road users out of it seamusl
  • Score: 4

4:21pm Fri 14 Feb 14

locodogz says...

seamusl wrote:
Two cyclists dead after being hit by a black bmw after going out of control after hitting a lamp post (possibly being pursued by police) at Purley, of course the bmw driver MUST have been obeying the law, most probably the cyclists fault for daring to be on the road. This appears to be the mode of thought of the anti cyclist brigade. Bitter ? you bet I am. I am scared (expletive deleted), I shouldn't have to feel as though my life/personal safety is on the line as I cycle to work. I obey ALL the laws even stopping at red lights in the wee hours when nothing else is about, I am lit like a Christmas tree even in overcast light or dodgey weather yet as I head out to work in a short while (yes I ride all year round) I am so so nervous. Right I have had my rant, let us enjoy life and be a little more forgiving to each other, those two poor cyclists deserve that as a memorial.
Seamus
"of course the bmw driver MUST have been obeying the law, most probably the cyclists fault for daring to be on the road."

Why are you writing this? Has anyone said this? I have to admit its the first I've heard about this tragic story. If no one has said this stuff can't you see you're simply hi-jacking someone's grief and applying your own 'twist' to suit your own agenda.

I also cycle (part of) my daily commute (its a long one - but I do the London bit!) and - whilst careful - couldn't do it if I felt my life was on the line daily.
[quote][p][bold]seamusl[/bold] wrote: Two cyclists dead after being hit by a black bmw after going out of control after hitting a lamp post (possibly being pursued by police) at Purley, of course the bmw driver MUST have been obeying the law, most probably the cyclists fault for daring to be on the road. This appears to be the mode of thought of the anti cyclist brigade. Bitter ? you bet I am. I am scared (expletive deleted), I shouldn't have to feel as though my life/personal safety is on the line as I cycle to work. I obey ALL the laws even stopping at red lights in the wee hours when nothing else is about, I am lit like a Christmas tree even in overcast light or dodgey weather yet as I head out to work in a short while (yes I ride all year round) I am so so nervous. Right I have had my rant, let us enjoy life and be a little more forgiving to each other, those two poor cyclists deserve that as a memorial. Seamus[/p][/quote]"of course the bmw driver MUST have been obeying the law, most probably the cyclists fault for daring to be on the road." Why are you writing this? Has anyone said this? I have to admit its the first I've heard about this tragic story. If no one has said this stuff can't you see you're simply hi-jacking someone's grief and applying your own 'twist' to suit your own agenda. I also cycle (part of) my daily commute (its a long one - but I do the London bit!) and - whilst careful - couldn't do it if I felt my life was on the line daily. locodogz
  • Score: -2

8:15pm Fri 14 Feb 14

seamusl says...

If no one has said this stuff can't you see you're simply hi-jacking someone's grief and applying your own 'twist' to suit your own agenda.

No agenda, I was a professional driver for over 26 years, in all that time nobody ever told me I had no right to be on the road something which is often said to cycle riders and implied at other times by the attitude of many vehicle drivers. How dare you say I have an agenda, I have had bottles thrown as I cycle through Cornmarket in the early hours (cycling allowed at that time) and been attacked by two yobs aiming kicks at me, another time people run out at me acting extremely aggressively (more than once) never happened to me while driving, strange.
Please re read some of the comments on here and assess whether my interpretation of their attitude is correct or not
If no one has said this stuff can't you see you're simply hi-jacking someone's grief and applying your own 'twist' to suit your own agenda. No agenda, I was a professional driver for over 26 years, in all that time nobody ever told me I had no right to be on the road something which is often said to cycle riders and implied at other times by the attitude of many vehicle drivers. How dare you say I have an agenda, I have had bottles thrown as I cycle through Cornmarket in the early hours (cycling allowed at that time) and been attacked by two yobs aiming kicks at me, another time people run out at me acting extremely aggressively (more than once) never happened to me while driving, strange. Please re read some of the comments on here and assess whether my interpretation of their attitude is correct or not seamusl
  • Score: 13

8:27pm Fri 14 Feb 14

seamusl says...

PS I have cycled in France and Northern Spain quite extensively and have never experienced the UK attitude toward cyclists, I am extremely curious as to why, the graciousness and care towards cyclists is something to behold and it is always with sadness that I realise I am back in Blighty by simple reason of a car screeching by and braking hard to corner in front of you, not just me Jeremy Vine recorded it happening to him on a head cam just a week or so ago
PS I have cycled in France and Northern Spain quite extensively and have never experienced the UK attitude toward cyclists, I am extremely curious as to why, the graciousness and care towards cyclists is something to behold and it is always with sadness that I realise I am back in Blighty by simple reason of a car screeching by and braking hard to corner in front of you, not just me Jeremy Vine recorded it happening to him on a head cam just a week or so ago seamusl
  • Score: 13

4:01am Sat 15 Feb 14

Dilligaf2010 says...

I see my comment got a few mentions, perhaps I should've worded it slightly differently, when I said hit one with my car, what I meant was, get one to hit my car, because they were travelling too fast along the pavement to stop, although either scenario would prove a point.
I don't hate all cyclists, I hate ignorant cyclists though, and some of those commenting must fit into the latter category, because nobody condemned the cyclists racing along the pavement, with little regard for pedestrians.
The article was about an ignorant cyclist, I made a comment about ignorant cyclists, yet the usual suspects condemn me, I'm also a cyclist, but I obey the rules, and therefore condemn those that don't.
I also condemn ignorant drivers, especially those that don't give sensible cyclists enough room on the road, drive around with lights not working, not indicating when turning, using mobile phones when driving (bluetooth headsets aren't expensive - I've got 3 of them) etc.
I see my comment got a few mentions, perhaps I should've worded it slightly differently, when I said hit one with my car, what I meant was, get one to hit my car, because they were travelling too fast along the pavement to stop, although either scenario would prove a point. I don't hate all cyclists, I hate ignorant cyclists though, and some of those commenting must fit into the latter category, because nobody condemned the cyclists racing along the pavement, with little regard for pedestrians. The article was about an ignorant cyclist, I made a comment about ignorant cyclists, yet the usual suspects condemn me, I'm also a cyclist, but I obey the rules, and therefore condemn those that don't. I also condemn ignorant drivers, especially those that don't give sensible cyclists enough room on the road, drive around with lights not working, not indicating when turning, using mobile phones when driving (bluetooth headsets aren't expensive - I've got 3 of them) etc. Dilligaf2010
  • Score: -1

5:23am Sat 15 Feb 14

seamusl says...

In fact apart from the first paragraph I think the majority here would agree with what you saying, I do have a go at irresponsible cyclists (one idiot cycling up Friars Entry got extremely threatening) after all I cycle and I don't want people associating me with brain dead antics of those that act stupidly, I do not have a go at car drivers acting illegally as the ones that have taken umbrage at me being on the road have acted aggressively enough already and I do have a desire to annoy my children for quite some time yet. Perhaps we ought to all meet and discuss ways to deal with the problems we have mention here with perhaps the agreement to wag a finger rather than point it,
In fact apart from the first paragraph I think the majority here would agree with what you saying, I do have a go at irresponsible cyclists (one idiot cycling up Friars Entry got extremely threatening) after all I cycle and I don't want people associating me with brain dead antics of those that act stupidly, I do not have a go at car drivers acting illegally as the ones that have taken umbrage at me being on the road have acted aggressively enough already and I do have a desire to annoy my children for quite some time yet. Perhaps we ought to all meet and discuss ways to deal with the problems we have mention here with perhaps the agreement to wag a finger rather than point it, seamusl
  • Score: 0

9:56am Sat 15 Feb 14

Dilligaf2010 says...

seamusl wrote:
In fact apart from the first paragraph I think the majority here would agree with what you saying, I do have a go at irresponsible cyclists (one idiot cycling up Friars Entry got extremely threatening) after all I cycle and I don't want people associating me with brain dead antics of those that act stupidly, I do not have a go at car drivers acting illegally as the ones that have taken umbrage at me being on the road have acted aggressively enough already and I do have a desire to annoy my children for quite some time yet. Perhaps we ought to all meet and discuss ways to deal with the problems we have mention here with perhaps the agreement to wag a finger rather than point it,
Unfortunately wagging fingers isn't going to achieve anything, the ignorant wouldn't take the slightest bit of notice, one of the cyclists that I asked to dismount, was a well spoken lady, but she was one of the most ignorant ones.
So it seems, even having a good upbringing doesn't prevent ignorance.
[quote][p][bold]seamusl[/bold] wrote: In fact apart from the first paragraph I think the majority here would agree with what you saying, I do have a go at irresponsible cyclists (one idiot cycling up Friars Entry got extremely threatening) after all I cycle and I don't want people associating me with brain dead antics of those that act stupidly, I do not have a go at car drivers acting illegally as the ones that have taken umbrage at me being on the road have acted aggressively enough already and I do have a desire to annoy my children for quite some time yet. Perhaps we ought to all meet and discuss ways to deal with the problems we have mention here with perhaps the agreement to wag a finger rather than point it,[/p][/quote]Unfortunately wagging fingers isn't going to achieve anything, the ignorant wouldn't take the slightest bit of notice, one of the cyclists that I asked to dismount, was a well spoken lady, but she was one of the most ignorant ones. So it seems, even having a good upbringing doesn't prevent ignorance. Dilligaf2010
  • Score: 0

10:03am Sat 15 Feb 14

Dilligaf2010 says...

seamusl wrote:
In fact apart from the first paragraph I think the majority here would agree with what you saying, I do have a go at irresponsible cyclists (one idiot cycling up Friars Entry got extremely threatening) after all I cycle and I don't want people associating me with brain dead antics of those that act stupidly, I do not have a go at car drivers acting illegally as the ones that have taken umbrage at me being on the road have acted aggressively enough already and I do have a desire to annoy my children for quite some time yet. Perhaps we ought to all meet and discuss ways to deal with the problems we have mention here with perhaps the agreement to wag a finger rather than point it,
The point I was trying to make with the first paragraph, was that I always go slow enough to observe pedestrians, and always let them cross the entrance of the car park, whether I'm entering, or leaving, but cyclists travelling at considerable speed wouldn't be visible to me, and would therefore hit my wing, and fly over my bonnet, which I'm sure would teach them a lesson.
They obviously had no concern for the pedestrians that would have to get out of their way, so why should I have concern for them, they were cycling on a reduced width footpath, with barriers along the kerb because the road was being rebuilt.
[quote][p][bold]seamusl[/bold] wrote: In fact apart from the first paragraph I think the majority here would agree with what you saying, I do have a go at irresponsible cyclists (one idiot cycling up Friars Entry got extremely threatening) after all I cycle and I don't want people associating me with brain dead antics of those that act stupidly, I do not have a go at car drivers acting illegally as the ones that have taken umbrage at me being on the road have acted aggressively enough already and I do have a desire to annoy my children for quite some time yet. Perhaps we ought to all meet and discuss ways to deal with the problems we have mention here with perhaps the agreement to wag a finger rather than point it,[/p][/quote]The point I was trying to make with the first paragraph, was that I always go slow enough to observe pedestrians, and always let them cross the entrance of the car park, whether I'm entering, or leaving, but cyclists travelling at considerable speed wouldn't be visible to me, and would therefore hit my wing, and fly over my bonnet, which I'm sure would teach them a lesson. They obviously had no concern for the pedestrians that would have to get out of their way, so why should I have concern for them, they were cycling on a reduced width footpath, with barriers along the kerb because the road was being rebuilt. Dilligaf2010
  • Score: 0

11:22am Sat 15 Feb 14

Deadwoodward says...

livid99 wrote:
Wanchai wrote:
livid99 wrote:
Deadwoodward wrote:
Just because motorists do stupid things, it does not stop us criticising cyclists who go whizzing through red lights. It is stupid, dangerous, illegal.
Exactly, but the arrogance and apparent inability to criticise other cyclists by some here makes it appear that jumping red lights and injuring someone is stupid, dangerous and illegal only if done by motorists, not cyclists. Then if we criticisie them we are called anti-cycling trolls.
Dilligaf2010 commented earlier about using a car as a weapon against cyclists - and it appears that you were unable to criticise that.

There's something very wrong with a certain section of drivers in Oxford. You sense it every time you take a bike out in this city. They are the ones on your tail, desperate to squeeze past, even when they know they will be stopping again in the next few metres.

Nobody here is defending the actions of the cyclist in the original story.
If Dilligaf2010 is being serious, then of course I condemn it.
I was not writing as a motorist.
Yes, motorists do not take enough care with cyclists - I have been knocked off my motor cycle (not Oxford) by a taxi, who thought I was slowing him down.

My point is that cyclists should not speed through red lights.

Something wrong with that?
[quote][p][bold]livid99[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Wanchai[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]livid99[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Deadwoodward[/bold] wrote: Just because motorists do stupid things, it does not stop us criticising cyclists who go whizzing through red lights. It is stupid, dangerous, illegal.[/p][/quote]Exactly, but the arrogance and apparent inability to criticise other cyclists by some here makes it appear that jumping red lights and injuring someone is stupid, dangerous and illegal only if done by motorists, not cyclists. Then if we criticisie them we are called anti-cycling trolls.[/p][/quote]Dilligaf2010 commented earlier about using a car as a weapon against cyclists - and it appears that you were unable to criticise that. There's something very wrong with a certain section of drivers in Oxford. You sense it every time you take a bike out in this city. They are the ones on your tail, desperate to squeeze past, even when they know they will be stopping again in the next few metres. Nobody here is defending the actions of the cyclist in the original story.[/p][/quote]If Dilligaf2010 is being serious, then of course I condemn it.[/p][/quote]I was not writing as a motorist. Yes, motorists do not take enough care with cyclists - I have been knocked off my motor cycle (not Oxford) by a taxi, who thought I was slowing him down. My point is that cyclists should not speed through red lights. Something wrong with that? Deadwoodward
  • Score: 6

1:19pm Sat 15 Feb 14

olafpalme says...

A road user is a road user. So, whether I am a cyclist, motorist, or pedestrian at the time, I view a cyclist/motorist/ped
estrian acting insanely as all alike. The mode is not important... they will act the same whatever they are doing.
However, there is a question as to which does the most damage to whom. And the Oxford Mail comments section, does not reflect this.
A road user is a road user. So, whether I am a cyclist, motorist, or pedestrian at the time, I view a cyclist/motorist/ped estrian acting insanely as all alike. The mode is not important... they will act the same whatever they are doing. However, there is a question as to which does the most damage to whom. And the Oxford Mail comments section, does not reflect this. olafpalme
  • Score: 5

1:39pm Sat 15 Feb 14

locodogz says...

olafpalme wrote:
A road user is a road user. So, whether I am a cyclist, motorist, or pedestrian at the time, I view a cyclist/motorist/ped

estrian acting insanely as all alike. The mode is not important... they will act the same whatever they are doing.
However, there is a question as to which does the most damage to whom. And the Oxford Mail comments section, does not reflect this.
"However, there is a question as to which does the most damage to whom"....and that where (IMHO) it all goes wrong.

You'd have to seriously deluded not to understand that a badly driven car will on average cause more damage than a badly ridden bike (although it should be stated that both can and have on occasion killed).

Then however it descends into the farce of does this mean - because cars can and will cause more damage - its OK for cyclists to flout the laws (I refer to the last major kick off on a comment piece that (if I recall correctly) did say something along the lines of 'because I was nearly killed by a car its "pathetic" to moan about cyclists misdemeanours'). This is the sentiment that appears to a red rag to a bull to some in the comments section?
[quote][p][bold]olafpalme[/bold] wrote: A road user is a road user. So, whether I am a cyclist, motorist, or pedestrian at the time, I view a cyclist/motorist/ped estrian acting insanely as all alike. The mode is not important... they will act the same whatever they are doing. However, there is a question as to which does the most damage to whom. And the Oxford Mail comments section, does not reflect this.[/p][/quote]"However, there is a question as to which does the most damage to whom"....and that where (IMHO) it all goes wrong. You'd have to seriously deluded not to understand that a badly driven car will on average cause more damage than a badly ridden bike (although it should be stated that both can and have on occasion killed). Then however it descends into the farce of does this mean - because cars can and will cause more damage - its OK for cyclists to flout the laws (I refer to the last major kick off on a comment piece that (if I recall correctly) did say something along the lines of 'because I was nearly killed by a car its "pathetic" to moan about cyclists misdemeanours'). This is the sentiment that appears to a red rag to a bull to some in the comments section? locodogz
  • Score: -2

4:40pm Sun 16 Feb 14

nedk14 says...

Dilligaf2010 wrote:
When the stretch of St. Aldate's was closed between Speedwell St, and Thames St., cyclists were ignoring the signs to dismount, and were cycling along the pavements at the same speed they would have on the road, even when I courteously asked them to push their bikes, as there are elderly residents in the adjacent block, I got torrents of abuse, I tried so hard to hit one with my car as they were speeding past the entrance to the car park, sadly I was either too early, or too late.
someones being an idiot and you think the correct response is to mow them down with your car.I think the problem is no one seems to realise there are good cyclists and bad ones just as with drivers.
[quote][p][bold]Dilligaf2010[/bold] wrote: When the stretch of St. Aldate's was closed between Speedwell St, and Thames St., cyclists were ignoring the signs to dismount, and were cycling along the pavements at the same speed they would have on the road, even when I courteously asked them to push their bikes, as there are elderly residents in the adjacent block, I got torrents of abuse, I tried so hard to hit one with my car as they were speeding past the entrance to the car park, sadly I was either too early, or too late.[/p][/quote]someones being an idiot and you think the correct response is to mow them down with your car.I think the problem is no one seems to realise there are good cyclists and bad ones just as with drivers. nedk14
  • Score: 2

11:00am Mon 17 Feb 14

cubist says...

when I said hit one with my car, what I meant was, get one to hit my car. careful vehicle reversing (Dilligaf)
when I said hit one with my car, what I meant was, get one to hit my car. careful vehicle reversing (Dilligaf) cubist
  • Score: -1

11:10am Mon 17 Feb 14

Canismajoris says...

Get well soon and good luck with your studies. Hopefully CCTV will catch the person who did this.
The crossing there is it in such a dangerous place, I have seen many near misses with buses and pedestrians and should be looked into to be improved.
Get well soon and good luck with your studies. Hopefully CCTV will catch the person who did this. The crossing there is it in such a dangerous place, I have seen many near misses with buses and pedestrians and should be looked into to be improved. Canismajoris
  • Score: 0

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