Pool to close despite battle (From The Oxford Times)

Finally, it's sorted. Hope there wasn't too much money spent by the council on the time-wasting by the "campaigners". At least Jane Alexander will be able to start a new fund raising campaign to keep her busy. If each of the "9000" petition signatories donate £167 - they'll be able to purchase the pool for a private venture.

Shame on them.

Campaigners have blown those figures through the water. It would be cheaper more cost effective, more environmentally friendly and what the people of Oxford want to redo the pools at BBL and Temple Cowley. This will devastate the community of Cowley.
It is not campaigners who have wasted our money it is our City Councillors who have demonstrated themselves as being out of touch and voting against what the people of Oxford want.

I have news for them. We won't stop fighting. And Andrew, this campaign is more than one person, so there is absolutely no need to be personal.

Will the new pool be the 50 meter one that Oxford desperatly needs?

I am saddened by the decision that Oxford City Council have made to close Temple Cowley Swimming Pools. A highly valued, busy facility used by many people of Oxford.

Yes the pools are in need of repair, this can not be denied. However, this is due to the fault of OCC and their poor budget management skills. The money for leisure facilities should be spent in this area and not elsewhere.

Now it is us, local people, regular users of TCP who are being punished as a result of the Council's wrong doing. Why should they be aloud to miss spend public funds, tax payers money and let good facilities go to rack and ruin?

I attended the Final Consultation Meeting and it was apparent to me that the Council were not willing to budge on this, they had already made their decision.

I commend the work that Jane Alexander and her fellow campaigners have done and are still doing. I for sure wont stop fighting this case and will feel sad the day TCP closes forever.

Joe: no, it won't be 50m, it will be the same size as Temple Cowley. That was a rumour put out originally to try and get support.
Ed: the campaign team has spoken to over 10,000 people about this issue, unlike any of the councillors who haven't dared come out to the public with us to hear what leisure swimmers and families actually want, which is to keep Temple Cowley Pools open. These are the people we speak to most often - shame that the councillors just don't care enough.
The vote this evening was for more housing for Brookes in Cowley instead of leisure facilities for the whole of the city; closing Temple Cowley Pools will also mean no diving pool anywhere in Oxford and no council supported leisure for the most densely populated area. See www.tiny.cc/savetcp or email savetcp@gmail.com for more info.

Don't be upset, I'm sure you did a lot of work in the campaign too. I do have good news for "the devasted community" of Cowley though. Units 3 & 4 of the John Allen Centre (Comet and formerly JJB) have been acquired by AsDa for a new store! Knew you'd be pleased - what the community has lost in one way, it's gaining in another.

Lost the quote on that last posting, it was addressed to Virginia Moffatt...

The promise that Temple Cowley Fitness Centre will remain open until the new centre is up and running will almost certainly be broken, because the council will claim they can't afford to maintain TC and build the new pool.

This means that hundreds of Temple Cowley leisure users face a protracted period when there will be no pool/gym at all and Oxford City Council have not acknowledged this at all.

Those who doubt this should look at what happened in Harlow where similar promises were made; the older facility was closed without warning in September 2007 with the council initially apologising for the "temporary closure"; in December 2007 the council met to vote through the permanent closure of the pool because they wanted to build 60 homes on the site. The new facility was only opened this year (June 2010)

Oxford City Council should at least have the guts to admit this is a distinct possibility for both Temple Cowley and Blackbird Leys residents.

Oxford City Council have also grossly inflated the estimates for refurbishing Temple Cowley Fitness Centre and this is simply a method of making their proposals seem reasonable: the technique involves inflating the estimates for the facility they want to close and downplaying the true costs of the new build.

In January this year the Council were claiming the new pool would only cost £8 million; that has already more than doubled!

Council estimates also tend to rise in response to negative publicity eg Carmarthenshire County Council did not open the Brynaman Pool this year because, they claimed, the pool needed £20,000 worth of repairs. As opposition to the closure mounted up that figure rose to £100,000 in the space of about four weeks!

I would like to see it made illegal for councils to do this unless they can provide truly independent proof of why costs have risen; the detail of any surveys carried out should be made fully available.

Andrew:Oxford wrote:
Finally, it's sorted. Hope there wasn't too much money spent by the council on the time-wasting by the "campaigners". At least Jane Alexander will be able to start a new fund raising campaign to keep her busy. If each of the "9000" petition signatories donate £167 - they'll be able to purchase the pool for a private venture.

Andrew, it appears that you are a patronising moron.

Take 30 Paracetamols and go to bed. We'll all feel much better in the morning.

Same old Tories, same old politics wrote:

Andrew:Oxford wrote:
Finally, it's sorted. Hope there wasn't too much money spent by the council on the time-wasting by the "campaigners". At least Jane Alexander will be able to start a new fund raising campaign to keep her busy. If each of the "9000" petition signatories donate £167 - they'll be able to purchase the pool for a private venture.

Andrew, it appears that you are a patronising moron.

Take 30 Paracetamols and go to bed. We'll all feel much better in the morning.

Oh dear, are you upset because you didn't get what you wanted? I'll be looking forward to patronising the beautful new pool when it opens, you can look forward to patronising your new AsDa. Probably best not to promote self-harm in a family newspaper though, the local constabulary tend to take a dim view of such things.

I've never ever seen something forced through like this. The council had already made their minds up before all of the meetings etc. They have got away with it and the public have let them. Time for people to start writing letters to MP's, the PM, and get some exposure in National Press and TV, because if you don't it will happen over and over again.

Andrew:Oxford wrote:

Same old Tories, same old politics wrote:

Andrew:Oxford wrote: Finally, it's sorted. Hope there wasn't too much money spent by the council on the time-wasting by the "campaigners". At least Jane Alexander will be able to start a new fund raising campaign to keep her busy. If each of the "9000" petition signatories donate £167 - they'll be able to purchase the pool for a private venture.

Andrew, it appears that you are a patronising moron. Take 30 Paracetamols and go to bed. We'll all feel much better in the morning.

Oh dear, are you upset because you didn't get what you wanted? I'll be looking forward to patronising the beautful new pool when it opens, you can look forward to patronising your new AsDa. Probably best not to promote self-harm in a family newspaper though, the local constabulary tend to take a dim view of such things.

1) I am not upset as suggested by my use of humour.

2) I don't want anything in this matter as I swim at the Ferry Hinksey Pool.

3) I don't shop at AsDa on principle.

4) The police aren't interested in jokes in the Oxford Mail comments section and if they were they would probably have made the same suggestion after reading your post.

5) Andrew, it appears that you are a patronising moron.

Take 30 Paracetamols and go to bed. We'll all feel much better in the morning.
I guarantee you.

6) I don't like finishing on an odd number.

Fantastic news
The dump has finally be closed
well done to the ouncil for making the right choice for once now lets scrap the 20mph speed limits

the wizard wrote:
I've never ever seen something forced through like this. The council had already made their minds up before all of the meetings etc. They have got away with it and the public have let them. Time for people to start writing letters to MP's, the PM, and get some exposure in National Press and TV, because if you don't it will happen over and over again.

Write to MP, not MPs. The near derelict TC pool and the fantastic planned new pool in the parish of BBL (for the enjoyment of the community of the whole of East/South Oxford) are both in the same constituency...

Same old Tories, same old politics wrote:

Andrew:Oxford wrote:

Same old Tories, same old politics wrote:

Andrew:Oxford wrote: Finally, it's sorted. Hope there wasn't too much money spent by the council on the time-wasting by the "campaigners". At least Jane Alexander will be able to start a new fund raising campaign to keep her busy. If each of the "9000" petition signatories donate £167 - they'll be able to purchase the pool for a private venture.

Andrew, it appears that you are a patronising moron. Take 30 Paracetamols and go to bed. We'll all feel much better in the morning.

Oh dear, are you upset because you didn't get what you wanted? I'll be looking forward to patronising the beautful new pool when it opens, you can look forward to patronising your new AsDa. Probably best not to promote self-harm in a family newspaper though, the local constabulary tend to take a dim view of such things.

1) I am not upset as suggested by my use of humour.

2) I don't want anything in this matter as I swim at the Ferry Hinksey Pool.

3) I don't shop at AsDa on principle.

4) The police aren't interested in jokes in the Oxford Mail comments section and if they were they would probably have made the same suggestion after reading your post.

5) Andrew, it appears that you are a patronising moron.

Take 30 Paracetamols and go to bed. We'll all feel much better in the morning.
I guarantee you.

6) I don't like finishing on an odd number.

I've checked. At my weight, 30 would be excessive. You only need 12mg of Paracetamol to prove fatal. Although that wouldn't be overnight... It would take about 3 days for complete renal failure to set in. Sounds a bit nasty really - I'll pass on the opportunity.

Andrew:Oxford wrote:

Same old Tories, same old politics wrote:

Andrew:Oxford wrote:

Same old Tories, same old politics wrote:

Andrew:Oxford wrote: Finally, it's sorted. Hope there wasn't too much money spent by the council on the time-wasting by the "campaigners". At least Jane Alexander will be able to start a new fund raising campaign to keep her busy. If each of the "9000" petition signatories donate £167 - they'll be able to purchase the pool for a private venture.

Andrew, it appears that you are a patronising moron. Take 30 Paracetamols and go to bed. We'll all feel much better in the morning.

Oh dear, are you upset because you didn't get what you wanted? I'll be looking forward to patronising the beautful new pool when it opens, you can look forward to patronising your new AsDa. Probably best not to promote self-harm in a family newspaper though, the local constabulary tend to take a dim view of such things.

1) I am not upset as suggested by my use of humour. 2) I don't want anything in this matter as I swim at the Ferry Hinksey Pool. 3) I don't shop at AsDa on principle. 4) The police aren't interested in jokes in the Oxford Mail comments section and if they were they would probably have made the same suggestion after reading your post. 5) Andrew, it appears that you are a patronising moron. Take 30 Paracetamols and go to bed. We'll all feel much better in the morning. I guarantee you. 6) I don't like finishing on an odd number.

I've checked. At my weight, 30 would be excessive. You only need 12mg of Paracetamol to prove fatal. Although that wouldn't be overnight... It would take about 3 days for complete renal failure to set in. Sounds a bit nasty really - I'll pass on the opportunity.

Spoilsport!

I really don't get what all the moaning is about. The new pool location is one mile away, will have plenty of parking, and is linked by public transport. Oxford seems to have far more swimming pools per square km than most cities, so people should quit whinging and be grateful for what fantastic facilities they already have.

Dear Andrew,

Thank you for you comments. There is simply no comparison between a shop and a community facility. Temple Cowley Pools needs some work admittedly but it is accessible, on a major transport hub, and is used and loved by young,old, people from minority ethnic communities, disabled people. You can't swim or sauna at Asda!

LadyPenelope, 1.6 miles doesn't sound much, if you drive, but the majority of people using TC Pools come by foot or bus. There are only two access roads across the ring road to Blackbird Leys. Most people who travel to Temple Cowley by bus get there on one route, going to BBL would take them longer and often mean two. This would add financial burden to people on low incomes. My children can get to Temple Cowley easily by themselves, they couldn't to Blackbird Leys.

Finally there are many places of work round Temple Cowley, the Business Park, PCT, Health Centres, OCC, Macmillan's, Oxfam. Workers in all these places can get there before/after work or at lunchtime. They couldn't to Blackbird Leys.

Well done to O.C.C, and at last we can stop having to listen to all the moaning minnies. But I am sure there will be another campaign coming along in a few minutes to keep them busy. As mentioned before if all those that signed the petition put their hands in their pockets, their beloved pool could have been saved. But it seems that their passion for saving it didn't go any further than signing their names.

Andrew:Oxford wrote:
Don't be upset, I'm sure you did a lot of work in the campaign too. I do have good news for "the devasted community" of Cowley though. Units 3 & 4 of the John Allen Centre (Comet and formerly JJB) have been acquired by AsDa for a new store! Knew you'd be pleased - what the community has lost in one way, it's gaining in another.

This daft and greedy Labour decision (designed to secure Labour held wards and Smith's constituency) will inadvertently benefit use of pools in Summertown and - in summer - off Abingdon Road.

A good idea on BBL would be for our ShCity Kremlin to emulate Esporta, by providing both a new indoor pool and an outdoor one. Also, Oxford needs a civic pool of Olympic dimension, ie 50m, and that should be honoured.

That made me smile :) hehehe

Simpleman, don't be silly. Cowley type people won't be welcome to mix with the North Oxford types at Summertown pool. Maybe they will have a special session (3-5am) for those with OX4 postcodes. P.S. looking forward to the new ASDA.

As long as we don't see Apu (geddit?) floating in the pools, it hardly matters.

Unless, like some, South East denizens of Oxford have anachronistic chips on their shoulders, I suspect enough might prefer a trip to Summertown or Abingdon Rd, where they'll feel as much or more at home than in either council pool beyond the ring road.

“The move has also been backed by the City Of Oxford Swimming Club, which said it needs a venue capable of holding regional galas.”
I’m glad the needs of 250 individuals (who largely do not live in the Cowley area) outweigh the needs and demands of 10,000 local residents! And as one of the few local parents of kids involved in the club – would you let your children cycle or get the bus to Black Bird Leyes at night to go training?
None of the numbers add up: If the site is worth £1.5 million (less £200,000-£300,000) for demolition and bringing the site up to standard to sell how is the council going to find the additional £15-17 million? Equally how can the filling in of one hole and moving it 1.6 miles cost £18 million where as a hole already dug to re-furbish or re-build costs £24 million? Does not make any sense – unless there are other skeletons aka Fusion leisure that the council has not let us know about?

I remember reading a report commissioned by the council in 2005-6 on the future of leisure facilities in Oxford (swimming and ice rink). Interesting it recommended that TCP needed to close and gave four options:
1. Refurbishment
2. Rebuild on present site
3. Build next to the David Lloyd site – discounted due to cost of rent of the site!
4. Build on the Marsh – by moving the council vehicles to council land on the ring road. (Preferred option and strongly recommended)
Interesting the report, after detailed consideration, recommended that BBL should not be considered as a move to BBL would deprive the local community and more importantly the City of leisure facilities.
Have gone back to the OCC website and the report has been removed. Have asked repeatedly for a copy and had no reply!! Done deal?