Tram possibility (From The Oxford Times)
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Tram possibility
11:00am Thursday 9th February 2012 in Headlines
Oxfordshire County Council has indicated it will carry out a feasibility study of a rapid transit light railway linking Cowley, Littlemore and the John Radcliffe Hospital to Redbridge or Oxford station “in the longer term”.
The Oxford Eastern Arc transit system was first put forwards in the Local Transport Plan 2011-2030. It has been included in the final version of the council’s Rail Strategy.
Comments(17)
King Joke
says...
12:13pm Thu 9 Feb 12
King Joke
says...
12:23pm Thu 9 Feb 12
That is not to say there is not potential for Cowley-Hospitals and along the Cowley Branch Line. THe demand is not there now probably because it's suppressed. I'd prove a demand for Cowley-Hospitals first by investing in a properly prioritised bus route. If demand proved high enough to justify a tram line most of the bus priority measures could be used by the tram.
THe Cowley Branch Line you'd have to take a punt on, as you can't run buses along it to prove demand. I'd build this last, as the success of the initial tram lines would have to be used in the business case for the Cowley Branch Line.
This
Dilligaf2010
says...
12:25pm Thu 9 Feb 12
Everything seems to be a possibility for the future, but when that date arrives, it then becomes further into the future, if something isn't done now, all that will be here in the future is the Universities and very little else.
iklhik
says...
1:03pm Thu 9 Feb 12
It will never happen but it won't stop the council wasting our money studing the lack of feasability.
King Joke
says...
1:44pm Thu 9 Feb 12
iklhik wrote:To use a technical term, you're talking out of the hole in your 4r5e.
Worth remembering the reason why trolleybuses were removed from Oxford in the first place is because they require incredible subsidy compared to buses and cars, and the tram tracks are hazardous to cyclists. (The trams probably would be too, bearing in mind some of the cyclists in Oxford, and the inability of trams to stop quickly). It will never happen but it won't stop the council wasting our money studing the lack of feasability.
Oxford never had trolleybuses, it had horse-drawn trams which were never electrified before being replaced by motor buses.
Trams can stop very quickly as all axles are braked and there are a lot of them. I've seen one pullin an emergency stop in Brussels and it was a quick as a bus.
It's a matter of opinion whether trams and bikes mix, but it does not appear to be a problem in cities like Amsterdam or Antwerp which have huge numbers of both.
Gunslinger
says...
2:07pm Thu 9 Feb 12
1. The demand for an orbital public transport route is unproven - if it were there, one might see buses taking such a route between Redbridge, Cowley and the JR using the ring road, rather than through the city centre.
2. Any route which doesn't actually go to the city centre is surely missing the point - as Edinburgh have found.
3. IF (big if) there is any case for using the Cowley freight line as a passenger route, then it would make more sense to continue from Redbridge into the city centre alongside the existing rail track (as the aborted bus scheme would have done).
This is all pie in the sky, window dressing, a nice bit of publicity for engineers in trade journals....
King Joke
says...
2:17pm Thu 9 Feb 12
I think what we do agree on is that the demand for radial routes is greater and would be the priority for starting a tram network.
Edinburgh is a good analogy. Many Lothian routes actually run orbitally rather than into the city centre. The busiest axis however is east-west via the city centre, which is why the first tram line is going that way.
Bart_Simpson1
says...
2:59pm Thu 9 Feb 12
King Joke
says...
3:09pm Thu 9 Feb 12
Bart_Simpson1 wrote:Now that I can't disagree with! Trams are pie-in-the-sky. The roads aren't too narrow though, trams need less room than buses as the rails keep them in a fixed envelope.
Trams will never be built in Oxford. The roads are to narrow and it will cost millions. Just look at what is happening in Edinburgh, they are millions over budget, years behind the finishing date. With Oxfords record of getting things done, it won't be in our lifetime!
EMBOX1
says...
4:49pm Thu 9 Feb 12
I lived in Nottingham from 1998-2004, before and after the trams were installed. The difference is amazing - very few buses and it just *works*.
Notts is a studenty city with 2 universities and numerous colleges, so lots of students but yes not as many bikes as here.
They're not cheap but it would make the city a much tidier place, and the good news is that the crazy cyclists won't argue with a tram!
King Joke
says...
4:57pm Thu 9 Feb 12
Patrick in Devon
says...
6:16pm Thu 9 Feb 12
Tunneling causes no disruption and works out cheaper as the lines can be straighter and shorter.
Who would pay? Today the Government threw another £50bn at the banks. Better if this money were spent directly on creating jobs and infrastructure.
Gunslinger
says...
10:06pm Thu 9 Feb 12
I suppose one could envisage a route from Barton west and/or the JR using land alongside the ring road (or converting part of the existing carriageway?) linking up to the Cowley freight line to Redbridge, then in to the city centre alongside the rail line. There would be some street running in the city in the Oxpens / Westgate area, and possibly in a loop around Barton and the JR.
The critical point would be whether or not end to end journey times from Barton and Cowley in to the city by such a circuitous route were significantly better than the present alternatives.
You would need mass passenger flows to justify the investment, a short route in the suburbs and/or with unproven traffic potential will not do it.
Synthesizer Man
says...
11:11pm Thu 9 Feb 12
Myron Blatz
says...
2:48am Fri 10 Feb 12
Patrick in Devon
says...
8:59am Sat 11 Feb 12
Electricity can be generated from whatever - nuclear, gas, coal, wind, sun or hydro. No oil gets burnt.
Gunslinger says...
11:56am Thu 9 Feb 12
Nimby's somewhere along the route will no doubt soon put a stop to this!