Dozens of cars trapped on M40 by snow (From The Oxford Times)

At least, we had several days notice and blanket media coverage this time.

No reasonable person would have got in their car without plenty of fuel, suitable warm clothing and some food.

The problem is mainly for lorries. Even with good notice, supplies must still be delivered. Supermarkets can't hold even one days food stocks in store. If road transport stops, for even one day, the country suffers. Main arterial roads must be ploughed and gritted as part of national policy. Failure is the fault of the government of the day. Whatever its colour.

xjohnx wrote:
The problem is mainly for lorries. Even with good notice, supplies must still be delivered. Supermarkets can't hold even one days food stocks in store. If road transport stops, for even one day, the country suffers. Main arterial roads must be ploughed and gritted as part of national policy. Failure is the fault of the government of the day. Whatever its colour.

I disagree. I think we all failed by creating and maintaining a system which makes us dependent on vehicles and roads. If more food was produced locally and local shops stocked it there would be no problem. There would be less food because we wouldn't be getting so much out of season stuff but... boo hoo.

Not just food: Take a look at the car factory in Cowley. 30 years ago most of the workers walked or cycled in from across the road. Snow was no a problem. Now they have to shut down production because so much of the workforce come from out of town and have to drive in.

This is utter stupidity as far as I'm concerned. Digging masses of salt out of mines, salt which we can't afford and is limited, is not an answer. The only answer I see is reducing dependency on vehicles.

Joe Chapman wrote:

xjohnx wrote:
The problem is mainly for lorries. Even with good notice, supplies must still be delivered. Supermarkets can't hold even one days food stocks in store. If road transport stops, for even one day, the country suffers. Main arterial roads must be ploughed and gritted as part of national policy. Failure is the fault of the government of the day. Whatever its colour.

I disagree. I think we all failed by creating and maintaining a system which makes us dependent on vehicles and roads. If more food was produced locally and local shops stocked it there would be no problem. There would be less food because we wouldn't be getting so much out of season stuff but... boo hoo.

Not just food: Take a look at the car factory in Cowley. 30 years ago most of the workers walked or cycled in from across the road. Snow was no a problem. Now they have to shut down production because so much of the workforce come from out of town and have to drive in.

This is utter stupidity as far as I'm concerned. Digging masses of salt out of mines, salt which we can't afford and is limited, is not an answer. The only answer I see is reducing dependency on vehicles.

would agree with that. years ago, nearly all workers worked locally, and could walk/cycle in, whereas now, many travel to work, either in nearby towns, or further afield, thus creating traffic. for some reason, locally produced food is more expensive than imported food. maybe it is because there isn't the volume sales, and the need for a profit exists. i would prefer to buy local produce, but it is just too costly. that is the need for transport.

Would it have not been easier for the councils to have just grit the road before the snow or as it started to fall lightly??, I came from high wycombe and they were all sat on the hard shoulder, then when i popped out last night local people near me were gritting and shoveling the roads themselves. many great thanks to the people of Headington Quarry...i do not know why we pay taxes when services are delivered, but fantastic community spirit

Joe Chapman wrote:

xjohnx wrote:
The problem is mainly for lorries. Even with good notice, supplies must still be delivered. Supermarkets can't hold even one days food stocks in store. If road transport stops, for even one day, the country suffers. Main arterial roads must be ploughed and gritted as part of national policy. Failure is the fault of the government of the day. Whatever its colour.

I disagree. I think we all failed by creating and maintaining a system which makes us dependent on vehicles and roads. If more food was produced locally and local shops stocked it there would be no problem. There would be less food because we wouldn't be getting so much out of season stuff but... boo hoo.

Not just food: Take a look at the car factory in Cowley. 30 years ago most of the workers walked or cycled in from across the road. Snow was no a problem. Now they have to shut down production because so much of the workforce come from out of town and have to drive in.

This is utter stupidity as far as I'm concerned. Digging masses of salt out of mines, salt which we can't afford and is limited, is not an answer. The only answer I see is reducing dependency on vehicles.

What you suggest means destroying almost all of our current society. Just try to adjust to what we already have to work with for now. Your suggestion is perhaps, for the future. Won't solve the now problems.

Joe Chapman wrote:

xjohnx wrote:
The problem is mainly for lorries. Even with good notice, supplies must still be delivered. Supermarkets can't hold even one days food stocks in store. If road transport stops, for even one day, the country suffers. Main arterial roads must be ploughed and gritted as part of national policy. Failure is the fault of the government of the day. Whatever its colour.

I disagree. I think we all failed by creating and maintaining a system which makes us dependent on vehicles and roads. If more food was produced locally and local shops stocked it there would be no problem. There would be less food because we wouldn't be getting so much out of season stuff but... boo hoo.

Not just food: Take a look at the car factory in Cowley. 30 years ago most of the workers walked or cycled in from across the road. Snow was no a problem. Now they have to shut down production because so much of the workforce come from out of town and have to drive in.

This is utter stupidity as far as I'm concerned. Digging masses of salt out of mines, salt which we can't afford and is limited, is not an answer. The only answer I see is reducing dependency on vehicles.

By the time the mines run out of salt, the Thames Valley will be so short of water that we'll be filtering the salt out of sea-water and pumping the potable water 100s of miles to Oxford.

We just need to use the salt by-product to keep the roads clear in the winter.

We will not have enough energy resource to desalinate all that water that will be needed on this over-crowded island. Especially for towns like Oxford.
.
Joe Chapman is on the right track by pointing out our over-dependence on the car and fossil fuels. It cannot go on regardless. If we don't find answers soon , Fate will step in and take the decision out of our hands.
.
Allow for the fact we are governed and dictated to by self-obsessed idiots of all types and at all levels.

We in the UK struggle with an inch of snow... Think of places where its heavier... They still survive. The country does not shut down because of it.. Why should we.. The councils should take a leaf out of the other countries books that are worse off than us!!

┄We in the UK struggle with an
inch of snow... Think of places
where its heavier... They still
survive. The country does not
shut down because of it..
Why should we.. The
councils should take a leaf
out of the other countries
books that are worse off than
us!!┄

Yep but there, they buy snow equipment for their cars/van's etc. Here we expect good old nanny state UK to solve all simple problems.

Btw: anyone who wants a good cold weather sleepingbag, 'Roman' an ozzy company but excellent cost, weight and performance..

You will all be buying your water from an independent Scotland (along with most of your oil)

lol

Let's not exaggerate the problem. On the M40 about 100 vehicles were stationery for 3 hours or so until the motorway was cleared. The UK salt reserves at current extraction rates will last for 500 years so, although I'm all for planning ahead, it would be premature to set up facilities for extracting road salt from seawater until about 2490.

I recall last year that the experts/planners or whatever name they wish to go by said that there would be no repeat of last years fiasco but not having enough grit/salt for the roads.

So one year on, the first spot of snow and things fall apart again. Where were the gritters and now ploughs? What plans were in place? If there were plans in place, then why did a major arterial route like the M40 end up closed?

We're told "heavy snow", "severe weather" and other such phrases all the time. We had 3 - 4 inches of snow. We knew it was coming. I went snowboarding a few years back in the Alps and my transfer bus drove me up the side of a mountain that had well over a foot of snow on it and the roads were clear. By the time the snow had got to about half an inch you'd hear the sound of the snow plough coming along to keep it clear.

It's about prevention and management. Neither of which we do very well when it comes to weather conditions that are slightly worse than normal.

I'll make a bet tht next year when it snows we have the same problem again and the same idiots will be on the TV afterwards apologising and saying that it won't happen again.

What's needed now are the ramblings about all of the new potholes and how they should have been refilled again from last year...