30,000 home garden city described as 'pie in the sky'

First published in News
Last updated
The Oxford Times: Photograph of the Author by , Reporter covering Abingdon and Wantage, South Oxford and Kennington. Call me on 01865 425431

AN ENTIRELY new city of more than 30,000 houses south of Oxford is being proposed for land previously earmarked for a £1bn reservoir.

But “Oxford Garden City”, the brainchild of one planning consultant working on behalf of a consortium of landowners, is already being dismissed as “pie in the sky”.

The new conurbation would slot between the Hanneys and Abingdon, where Thames Water formerly wanted to build a reservoir.

Planning consultant Ken Dijksman delivered an outline of the scheme to Vale of White Horse District Council as part of the consultation on its new Local Plan for development.

The land proposed is more than 2,000 hectares, outside the Oxford green belt, and not part of an Area of Outstanding Natural Beauty (AONB).

Mr Dijksman, acting on behalf of several landowners who he wouldn’t name, said: “At the moment we have a national problem in terms of economy and house building.

“Oxford Garden City solves the future housing, employment and infrastructure problems of Oxford, South Oxfordshire District, the Vale of White Horse and the whole county for 30 years.

“This site can accommodate over 30,000 houses and hundreds of hectares of employment land.”

The Government’s South East Plan for Oxfordshire, adopted in 2009, required 55,200 houses to be built in the 20 years to 2026.

However, the targets in that plan were abandoned earlier this year, and will be replaced by a Strategic Housing Market Assessment, due to be conducted by all five district councils this year.

Mr Dijksman said Abingdon has a population of around 36,000 and Letchworth Garden City, in Hertford-shire – one of the first of its kind – has a population of 33,000.

Deputy leader of Oxfordshire County Council Rodney Rose said that Oxford had a problem with expansion, but this was not the solution.

He said: “The proposal for the eco-town wasn’t welcomed in Cherwell, so a garden city has been objected to at least once in Oxfordshire.

“The problem with Oxfordshire is that Oxford can’t make itself bigger, but I don’t think a garden city is the solution.

“He is making an assumption that other areas don’t want housing, which is not correct. Carterton and Bicester both want new houses.”

Between 1990 and 2011, Thames Water tried to get permission to build a £1bn reservoir on the land before the Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs (Defra) rejected the bid.

Oxford city councillor and chairman of the East Area Planning Committee Roy Darke said: “Everyone is agreed, expansion is a problem for Oxford and, in principle, this is a good idea.

“Oxford needs to expand, we have a thriving economy. Oxfordshire’s economy is generated from Oxford.

“But what we really need is housing that would be close to the centre.

“I would rather see small expansions around Oxford.”

Vale of White Horse District Council leader Matthew Barber said: “There is no realistic thought given to infrastructure, new schools or how it would be funded.

“It will obviously go through the official channels of our Local Plan, but anyone can see it is a pie in the sky.”

Mr Dijksman, based in Newbury, said it would be at least 10 years before construction could start. He said: “There are geographical advantages which make development on this area almost inevitable. This is not going to go away.”

For the scheme to go ahead, planning permission would need to be granted for any part of the new town and developers found to build it.

  • The garden city movement started in the late 19th century in the wake of increasing urbanisation. Attempts to create settlements which balanced development and open space were pioneered at Letchworth, Welwyn Garden City and Hampstead.

Comments (30)

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9:09am Wed 3 Jul 13

Andrew:Oxford says...

Campaigners should be careful what they wish for...

Let's hope it is planned with a railway connection from the very start!
Campaigners should be careful what they wish for... Let's hope it is planned with a railway connection from the very start! Andrew:Oxford
  • Score: 6

9:27am Wed 3 Jul 13

the wizard says...

If it were to ever get the go ahead and approval it would be an ideal place to build another hospital as Abingdon, Didcot, Wantage and Grove have all grown substantially since the JR was built. You cannot keep building more homes for more people without considering the population growth for the area and its subsequent needs. The JR is now over capacity and the area needs a second major hospital to cope.

Perhaps with the reduction in our armed forces Dalton Barracks would be a better location as it would not take away as much prime farm land, although not so much of a clean sheet it would make a lesser impact on necessary agriculture.
If it were to ever get the go ahead and approval it would be an ideal place to build another hospital as Abingdon, Didcot, Wantage and Grove have all grown substantially since the JR was built. You cannot keep building more homes for more people without considering the population growth for the area and its subsequent needs. The JR is now over capacity and the area needs a second major hospital to cope. Perhaps with the reduction in our armed forces Dalton Barracks would be a better location as it would not take away as much prime farm land, although not so much of a clean sheet it would make a lesser impact on necessary agriculture. the wizard
  • Score: 4

10:28am Wed 3 Jul 13

Myron Blatz says...

It isn't about 'providing homes' but all about making grotesquely fat profits for Tory landowners and developers. Nor has this any relationship with the massive negative effect on the Thames and its floodplain, or the huge additional drain on natursl water table supplies - and where the heck would all that sewage, didposable nappies and used sanitary waste go to? Oxfordshire, the South and South East doesn't need 'more people' for even more jobs - but the people of South Wales, the North East and North West certainly do need more investment and that four-letter word which proud people with proud heritages aren't afraid of doing - WORK! time for planning authorities to protect for the long term, and not cave-in to short-medium term financial gain and pressure from the Tory land-owning rural elite!
It isn't about 'providing homes' but all about making grotesquely fat profits for Tory landowners and developers. Nor has this any relationship with the massive negative effect on the Thames and its floodplain, or the huge additional drain on natursl water table supplies - and where the heck would all that sewage, didposable nappies and used sanitary waste go to? Oxfordshire, the South and South East doesn't need 'more people' for even more jobs - but the people of South Wales, the North East and North West certainly do need more investment and that four-letter word which proud people with proud heritages aren't afraid of doing - WORK! time for planning authorities to protect for the long term, and not cave-in to short-medium term financial gain and pressure from the Tory land-owning rural elite! Myron Blatz
  • Score: -40

12:19pm Wed 3 Jul 13

downsview says...

Solution to the problem is to let Oxford grow - the garden city concept would be a good one to build south of Grenoble Road & off the Horspath Road - with a planned p/transport system that links to the City Centre JR & business parks.

So much of the issue with traffic congestion on the A34 & A40 in partic. is caused by Oxford based workers who live out of the City.
Good to see a number of councillors making public statements that reflect the need for the Oxford Green Belt to be adapted to provide space for people to have homes to live in!
Solution to the problem is to let Oxford grow - the garden city concept would be a good one to build south of Grenoble Road & off the Horspath Road - with a planned p/transport system that links to the City Centre JR & business parks. So much of the issue with traffic congestion on the A34 & A40 in partic. is caused by Oxford based workers who live out of the City. Good to see a number of councillors making public statements that reflect the need for the Oxford Green Belt to be adapted to provide space for people to have homes to live in! downsview
  • Score: 1

1:15pm Wed 3 Jul 13

Mark L. says...

“This site can accommodate over 30,000 houses and hundreds of hectares of employment land.”

Yes, but not the Roads, Schools, Hospitals, Doctors etc. etc... The developers really do want to concrete over Oxfordshire. You will end up being like Surrey where I used to live and where it takes an hour to commute 12 miles!!.
“This site can accommodate over 30,000 houses and hundreds of hectares of employment land.” Yes, but not the Roads, Schools, Hospitals, Doctors etc. etc... The developers really do want to concrete over Oxfordshire. You will end up being like Surrey where I used to live and where it takes an hour to commute 12 miles!!. Mark L.
  • Score: 1

1:35pm Wed 3 Jul 13

museli says...

So I guess they mean those fields to the East of the A338 that flood every couple of years?
So I guess they mean those fields to the East of the A338 that flood every couple of years? museli
  • Score: 4

1:38pm Wed 3 Jul 13

Drayton Wasps says...

I hope all those anti reseervoir campaigners are happy now. I can't believe they were all so naive to think that something like this would not be proposed next. I for one supported the reservoir proposal for obvious leisure and environmental reasons, and would much rather have a reservoir than another sprawling housing estate. Thanks !
I hope all those anti reseervoir campaigners are happy now. I can't believe they were all so naive to think that something like this would not be proposed next. I for one supported the reservoir proposal for obvious leisure and environmental reasons, and would much rather have a reservoir than another sprawling housing estate. Thanks ! Drayton Wasps
  • Score: 9

2:10pm Wed 3 Jul 13

West Oxon Webwatcher says...

Mark L says "Come to Surrey where it takes an hour to commute 12 miles. That sounds just like commuting from West Oxon to Oxford is at preent!
The trouble is that there are so many vested interests that want development but also too many communities that equally do not want it. mVarious objections quoted against the idea but no reasons given. Rodney rose objects but does not give any valid reasons. He says that Carterton and Bicester wants development. Has there been a vote on that amongst Carterton residents. There seem to be many objections to the current Carterton proposals for some 2,000 homes. These together with those at Witney mean that west Oxon faces horrendous A40 traffic congestion as no adequate solution is being put forward. You can go on and on with objections but were are the advantages for Oxon residents of more development. Looks like it needed to house the millions of immigrants already in the country.
Mark L says "Come to Surrey where it takes an hour to commute 12 miles. That sounds just like commuting from West Oxon to Oxford is at preent! The trouble is that there are so many vested interests that want development but also too many communities that equally do not want it. mVarious objections quoted against the idea but no reasons given. Rodney rose objects but does not give any valid reasons. He says that Carterton and Bicester wants development. Has there been a vote on that amongst Carterton residents. There seem to be many objections to the current Carterton proposals for some 2,000 homes. These together with those at Witney mean that west Oxon faces horrendous A40 traffic congestion as no adequate solution is being put forward. You can go on and on with objections but were are the advantages for Oxon residents of more development. Looks like it needed to house the millions of immigrants already in the country. West Oxon Webwatcher
  • Score: -13

5:45pm Wed 3 Jul 13

docs says...

Mark L. wrote:
“This site can accommodate over 30,000 houses and hundreds of hectares of employment land.”

Yes, but not the Roads, Schools, Hospitals, Doctors etc. etc... The developers really do want to concrete over Oxfordshire. You will end up being like Surrey where I used to live and where it takes an hour to commute 12 miles!!.
An hour to commute 12 miles?

Last week, I foolishly had an appointment for 5.15pm in North Hinksey. It took me 55 minutes to get there from Grandpont - less than 3 miles, I think.
[quote][p][bold]Mark L.[/bold] wrote: “This site can accommodate over 30,000 houses and hundreds of hectares of employment land.” Yes, but not the Roads, Schools, Hospitals, Doctors etc. etc... The developers really do want to concrete over Oxfordshire. You will end up being like Surrey where I used to live and where it takes an hour to commute 12 miles!!.[/p][/quote]An hour to commute 12 miles? Last week, I foolishly had an appointment for 5.15pm in North Hinksey. It took me 55 minutes to get there from Grandpont - less than 3 miles, I think. docs
  • Score: 0

5:59pm Wed 3 Jul 13

jockox3 says...

I will probably only say this once in my life, but "I agree with Roy" :)
I will probably only say this once in my life, but "I agree with Roy" :) jockox3
  • Score: 0

6:16pm Wed 3 Jul 13

Danny A says...

Andrew:Oxford wrote:
Campaigners should be careful what they wish for...

Let's hope it is planned with a railway connection from the very start!
Would be nice to think that they would add a new station on the main line. However, I'm sure developers would be tempted to just reopen the Steventon slip of the A34. In which case you might as well walk to Oxford because it will be quicker
[quote][p][bold]Andrew:Oxford[/bold] wrote: Campaigners should be careful what they wish for... Let's hope it is planned with a railway connection from the very start![/p][/quote]Would be nice to think that they would add a new station on the main line. However, I'm sure developers would be tempted to just reopen the Steventon slip of the A34. In which case you might as well walk to Oxford because it will be quicker Danny A
  • Score: 1

6:20pm Wed 3 Jul 13

Patrick in Devon says...

The purpose of the green belt is to prevent urban sprawl and poorly planned ribbon development. What seems to be happening is the development of an urban belt beyond the green belt. Perhaps it should be renamed the greeb donut. This results in too much local travel, and severe housing shortages in the middle of the donut. Is this good planning?
The purpose of the green belt is to prevent urban sprawl and poorly planned ribbon development. What seems to be happening is the development of an urban belt beyond the green belt. Perhaps it should be renamed the greeb donut. This results in too much local travel, and severe housing shortages in the middle of the donut. Is this good planning? Patrick in Devon
  • Score: -16

7:18pm Wed 3 Jul 13

Citizen Sunday says...

Yet more boring housing to house the more boring members of society who just love to live in these boring developments.
What happened to natural selection?
Yet more boring housing to house the more boring members of society who just love to live in these boring developments. What happened to natural selection? Citizen Sunday
  • Score: -50

2:04am Thu 4 Jul 13

J B Blackett says...

These sly greedy money-grubbing people are determined to concrete over the whole of Southern England - and stuff the consequences as long as there is crooked money in it for them
These sly greedy money-grubbing people are determined to concrete over the whole of Southern England - and stuff the consequences as long as there is crooked money in it for them J B Blackett
  • Score: -1

8:56am Thu 4 Jul 13

Andrew:Oxford says...

J B Blackett wrote:
These sly greedy money-grubbing people are determined to concrete over the whole of Southern England - and stuff the consequences as long as there is crooked money in it for them
What would you do instead?

Perhaps demand that people, the day after retirement, immediately sell their homes and move somewhere with plenty of empty housing...

Hull? Liverpool? Ireland?

Or maybe something a bit more radical?

Social housing tenants forced to move somewhere cheaper to allow someone who has found a job somewhere to live in Oxford?

It would make sense if you consider the carbon impact...

Which would you recommend?
[quote][p][bold]J B Blackett[/bold] wrote: These sly greedy money-grubbing people are determined to concrete over the whole of Southern England - and stuff the consequences as long as there is crooked money in it for them[/p][/quote]What would you do instead? Perhaps demand that people, the day after retirement, immediately sell their homes and move somewhere with plenty of empty housing... Hull? Liverpool? Ireland? Or maybe something a bit more radical? Social housing tenants forced to move somewhere cheaper to allow someone who has found a job somewhere to live in Oxford? It would make sense if you consider the carbon impact... Which would you recommend? Andrew:Oxford
  • Score: 2

9:04am Thu 4 Jul 13

jockox3 says...

The sly greedy money-grabbing folk are those who demand their house prices remain high whilst others struggle for housing. Even in the South-East of England, if we all lived at the density of a Singapore or Monaco we'd all fit on the Isle of Wight and the rest could be "green and pleasant land". Just look at a Google earth image of Oxfordshire - nowhere near "concreted over". People are making up self-interested excuses for preventing others having a decent standard of living.
The sly greedy money-grabbing folk are those who demand their house prices remain high whilst others struggle for housing. Even in the South-East of England, if we all lived at the density of a Singapore or Monaco we'd all fit on the Isle of Wight and the rest could be "green and pleasant land". Just look at a Google earth image of Oxfordshire - nowhere near "concreted over". People are making up self-interested excuses for preventing others having a decent standard of living. jockox3
  • Score: -4

9:05am Thu 4 Jul 13

jockox3 says...

A few years ago a think tank suggested Oxford and Cambridge should both be about a million households the better to capitalise on their international reputations. I had a little fun with this: http://jockcoats.me/
oxford_million_minds
_bit_fun
A few years ago a think tank suggested Oxford and Cambridge should both be about a million households the better to capitalise on their international reputations. I had a little fun with this: http://jockcoats.me/ oxford_million_minds _bit_fun jockox3
  • Score: -4

11:28am Thu 4 Jul 13

Bertie22 says...

Andrew:Oxford wrote:
J B Blackett wrote:
These sly greedy money-grubbing people are determined to concrete over the whole of Southern England - and stuff the consequences as long as there is crooked money in it for them
What would you do instead?

Perhaps demand that people, the day after retirement, immediately sell their homes and move somewhere with plenty of empty housing...

Hull? Liverpool? Ireland?

Or maybe something a bit more radical?

Social housing tenants forced to move somewhere cheaper to allow someone who has found a job somewhere to live in Oxford?

It would make sense if you consider the carbon impact...

Which would you recommend?
Calm down, Norris
[quote][p][bold]Andrew:Oxford[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]J B Blackett[/bold] wrote: These sly greedy money-grubbing people are determined to concrete over the whole of Southern England - and stuff the consequences as long as there is crooked money in it for them[/p][/quote]What would you do instead? Perhaps demand that people, the day after retirement, immediately sell their homes and move somewhere with plenty of empty housing... Hull? Liverpool? Ireland? Or maybe something a bit more radical? Social housing tenants forced to move somewhere cheaper to allow someone who has found a job somewhere to live in Oxford? It would make sense if you consider the carbon impact... Which would you recommend?[/p][/quote]Calm down, Norris Bertie22
  • Score: -31

12:36pm Thu 4 Jul 13

Andrew:Oxford says...

Bertie22 wrote:
Andrew:Oxford wrote:
J B Blackett wrote:
These sly greedy money-grubbing people are determined to concrete over the whole of Southern England - and stuff the consequences as long as there is crooked money in it for them
What would you do instead?

Perhaps demand that people, the day after retirement, immediately sell their homes and move somewhere with plenty of empty housing...

Hull? Liverpool? Ireland?

Or maybe something a bit more radical?

Social housing tenants forced to move somewhere cheaper to allow someone who has found a job somewhere to live in Oxford?

It would make sense if you consider the carbon impact...

Which would you recommend?
Calm down, Norris
Thanks Bertie :)

Took me a moment to find the reference... For people who don't know it, it's a new cartoon character...

"...Norris has eyes as blue as fjords and blond hair, as spiky as a hedgehog. Norris is tall, strong and very athletic..."

Well, you're right on the blond hair, blue eyes and tall.

Maybe if I were to swim and gym more than a couple of times a week I'd be the rest too.
[quote][p][bold]Bertie22[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Andrew:Oxford[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]J B Blackett[/bold] wrote: These sly greedy money-grubbing people are determined to concrete over the whole of Southern England - and stuff the consequences as long as there is crooked money in it for them[/p][/quote]What would you do instead? Perhaps demand that people, the day after retirement, immediately sell their homes and move somewhere with plenty of empty housing... Hull? Liverpool? Ireland? Or maybe something a bit more radical? Social housing tenants forced to move somewhere cheaper to allow someone who has found a job somewhere to live in Oxford? It would make sense if you consider the carbon impact... Which would you recommend?[/p][/quote]Calm down, Norris[/p][/quote]Thanks Bertie :) Took me a moment to find the reference... For people who don't know it, it's a new cartoon character... "...Norris has eyes as blue as fjords and blond hair, as spiky as a hedgehog. Norris is tall, strong and very athletic..." Well, you're right on the blond hair, blue eyes and tall. Maybe if I were to swim and gym more than a couple of times a week I'd be the rest too. Andrew:Oxford
  • Score: -1

12:43pm Thu 4 Jul 13

Bertie22 says...

Andrew:Oxford wrote:
Bertie22 wrote:
Andrew:Oxford wrote:
J B Blackett wrote:
These sly greedy money-grubbing people are determined to concrete over the whole of Southern England - and stuff the consequences as long as there is crooked money in it for them
What would you do instead?

Perhaps demand that people, the day after retirement, immediately sell their homes and move somewhere with plenty of empty housing...

Hull? Liverpool? Ireland?

Or maybe something a bit more radical?

Social housing tenants forced to move somewhere cheaper to allow someone who has found a job somewhere to live in Oxford?

It would make sense if you consider the carbon impact...

Which would you recommend?
Calm down, Norris
Thanks Bertie :)

Took me a moment to find the reference... For people who don't know it, it's a new cartoon character...

"...Norris has eyes as blue as fjords and blond hair, as spiky as a hedgehog. Norris is tall, strong and very athletic..."

Well, you're right on the blond hair, blue eyes and tall.

Maybe if I were to swim and gym more than a couple of times a week I'd be the rest too.
Try Coronation Street
[quote][p][bold]Andrew:Oxford[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Bertie22[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Andrew:Oxford[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]J B Blackett[/bold] wrote: These sly greedy money-grubbing people are determined to concrete over the whole of Southern England - and stuff the consequences as long as there is crooked money in it for them[/p][/quote]What would you do instead? Perhaps demand that people, the day after retirement, immediately sell their homes and move somewhere with plenty of empty housing... Hull? Liverpool? Ireland? Or maybe something a bit more radical? Social housing tenants forced to move somewhere cheaper to allow someone who has found a job somewhere to live in Oxford? It would make sense if you consider the carbon impact... Which would you recommend?[/p][/quote]Calm down, Norris[/p][/quote]Thanks Bertie :) Took me a moment to find the reference... For people who don't know it, it's a new cartoon character... "...Norris has eyes as blue as fjords and blond hair, as spiky as a hedgehog. Norris is tall, strong and very athletic..." Well, you're right on the blond hair, blue eyes and tall. Maybe if I were to swim and gym more than a couple of times a week I'd be the rest too.[/p][/quote]Try Coronation Street Bertie22
  • Score: -27

1:22pm Thu 4 Jul 13

Andrew:Oxford says...

Bertie22 wrote:
Andrew:Oxford wrote:
Bertie22 wrote:
Andrew:Oxford wrote:
J B Blackett wrote:
These sly greedy money-grubbing people are determined to concrete over the whole of Southern England - and stuff the consequences as long as there is crooked money in it for them
What would you do instead?

Perhaps demand that people, the day after retirement, immediately sell their homes and move somewhere with plenty of empty housing...

Hull? Liverpool? Ireland?

Or maybe something a bit more radical?

Social housing tenants forced to move somewhere cheaper to allow someone who has found a job somewhere to live in Oxford?

It would make sense if you consider the carbon impact...

Which would you recommend?
Calm down, Norris
Thanks Bertie :)

Took me a moment to find the reference... For people who don't know it, it's a new cartoon character...

"...Norris has eyes as blue as fjords and blond hair, as spiky as a hedgehog. Norris is tall, strong and very athletic..."

Well, you're right on the blond hair, blue eyes and tall.

Maybe if I were to swim and gym more than a couple of times a week I'd be the rest too.
Try Coronation Street
I think the first reference (from "The Guardian" yesterday) is far better.

:)

I've previously turned down the opportunity to play a "walk-on" part on that particular ITV series.

It's a bit "Northern".
[quote][p][bold]Bertie22[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Andrew:Oxford[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Bertie22[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Andrew:Oxford[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]J B Blackett[/bold] wrote: These sly greedy money-grubbing people are determined to concrete over the whole of Southern England - and stuff the consequences as long as there is crooked money in it for them[/p][/quote]What would you do instead? Perhaps demand that people, the day after retirement, immediately sell their homes and move somewhere with plenty of empty housing... Hull? Liverpool? Ireland? Or maybe something a bit more radical? Social housing tenants forced to move somewhere cheaper to allow someone who has found a job somewhere to live in Oxford? It would make sense if you consider the carbon impact... Which would you recommend?[/p][/quote]Calm down, Norris[/p][/quote]Thanks Bertie :) Took me a moment to find the reference... For people who don't know it, it's a new cartoon character... "...Norris has eyes as blue as fjords and blond hair, as spiky as a hedgehog. Norris is tall, strong and very athletic..." Well, you're right on the blond hair, blue eyes and tall. Maybe if I were to swim and gym more than a couple of times a week I'd be the rest too.[/p][/quote]Try Coronation Street[/p][/quote]I think the first reference (from "The Guardian" yesterday) is far better. :) I've previously turned down the opportunity to play a "walk-on" part on that particular ITV series. It's a bit "Northern". Andrew:Oxford
  • Score: -1

1:28pm Thu 4 Jul 13

Bertie22 says...

Andrew:Oxford wrote:
Bertie22 wrote:
Andrew:Oxford wrote:
Bertie22 wrote:
Andrew:Oxford wrote:
J B Blackett wrote:
These sly greedy money-grubbing people are determined to concrete over the whole of Southern England - and stuff the consequences as long as there is crooked money in it for them
What would you do instead?

Perhaps demand that people, the day after retirement, immediately sell their homes and move somewhere with plenty of empty housing...

Hull? Liverpool? Ireland?

Or maybe something a bit more radical?

Social housing tenants forced to move somewhere cheaper to allow someone who has found a job somewhere to live in Oxford?

It would make sense if you consider the carbon impact...

Which would you recommend?
Calm down, Norris
Thanks Bertie :)

Took me a moment to find the reference... For people who don't know it, it's a new cartoon character...

"...Norris has eyes as blue as fjords and blond hair, as spiky as a hedgehog. Norris is tall, strong and very athletic..."

Well, you're right on the blond hair, blue eyes and tall.

Maybe if I were to swim and gym more than a couple of times a week I'd be the rest too.
Try Coronation Street
I think the first reference (from "The Guardian" yesterday) is far better.

:)

I've previously turned down the opportunity to play a "walk-on" part on that particular ITV series.

It's a bit "Northern".
Nope, definitely the corrie character is more apt for you
[quote][p][bold]Andrew:Oxford[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Bertie22[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Andrew:Oxford[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Bertie22[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Andrew:Oxford[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]J B Blackett[/bold] wrote: These sly greedy money-grubbing people are determined to concrete over the whole of Southern England - and stuff the consequences as long as there is crooked money in it for them[/p][/quote]What would you do instead? Perhaps demand that people, the day after retirement, immediately sell their homes and move somewhere with plenty of empty housing... Hull? Liverpool? Ireland? Or maybe something a bit more radical? Social housing tenants forced to move somewhere cheaper to allow someone who has found a job somewhere to live in Oxford? It would make sense if you consider the carbon impact... Which would you recommend?[/p][/quote]Calm down, Norris[/p][/quote]Thanks Bertie :) Took me a moment to find the reference... For people who don't know it, it's a new cartoon character... "...Norris has eyes as blue as fjords and blond hair, as spiky as a hedgehog. Norris is tall, strong and very athletic..." Well, you're right on the blond hair, blue eyes and tall. Maybe if I were to swim and gym more than a couple of times a week I'd be the rest too.[/p][/quote]Try Coronation Street[/p][/quote]I think the first reference (from "The Guardian" yesterday) is far better. :) I've previously turned down the opportunity to play a "walk-on" part on that particular ITV series. It's a bit "Northern".[/p][/quote]Nope, definitely the corrie character is more apt for you Bertie22
  • Score: -17

1:37pm Thu 4 Jul 13

EMBOX2 says...

It's a shame we're not likely to see homes built on the soon to be demolished Didcot A site - that is ripe for development, but instead we'll see more warehouses whilst local villages suffer.

For some reason, we in the UK want to keep houses and industry separate. Nowhere else does this happen. People living so far from work is a very UK thing - and one reason why we're all so tired out!
It's a shame we're not likely to see homes built on the soon to be demolished Didcot A site - that is ripe for development, but instead we'll see more warehouses whilst local villages suffer. For some reason, we in the UK want to keep houses and industry separate. Nowhere else does this happen. People living so far from work is a very UK thing - and one reason why we're all so tired out! EMBOX2
  • Score: 2

2:02pm Thu 4 Jul 13

Andrew:Oxford says...

Bertie22 wrote:
Andrew:Oxford wrote:
Bertie22 wrote:
Andrew:Oxford wrote:
Bertie22 wrote:
Andrew:Oxford wrote:
J B Blackett wrote: These sly greedy money-grubbing people are determined to concrete over the whole of Southern England - and stuff the consequences as long as there is crooked money in it for them
What would you do instead? Perhaps demand that people, the day after retirement, immediately sell their homes and move somewhere with plenty of empty housing... Hull? Liverpool? Ireland? Or maybe something a bit more radical? Social housing tenants forced to move somewhere cheaper to allow someone who has found a job somewhere to live in Oxford? It would make sense if you consider the carbon impact... Which would you recommend?
Calm down, Norris
Thanks Bertie :) Took me a moment to find the reference... For people who don't know it, it's a new cartoon character... "...Norris has eyes as blue as fjords and blond hair, as spiky as a hedgehog. Norris is tall, strong and very athletic..." Well, you're right on the blond hair, blue eyes and tall. Maybe if I were to swim and gym more than a couple of times a week I'd be the rest too.
Try Coronation Street
I think the first reference (from "The Guardian" yesterday) is far better. :) I've previously turned down the opportunity to play a "walk-on" part on that particular ITV series. It's a bit "Northern".
Nope, definitely the corrie character is more apt for you
I'm quite sure "The Guardian" reference is the right one, it's the first that came up on Google.

There may well be a subliminal connection there - clearly you embrace the regular goings on of the fictional street in Manchester, so probably read "The Guardian" which was, of course, orginally "The Manchester Guardian".

After reading the story you immediately associated "Tall, strong, athletic, blond haired, blue eyed and intelligent" with me.

You are "Bertie" with an "ie" so I'm really quite flattered. (But no touching, thank you.)
[quote][p][bold]Bertie22[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Andrew:Oxford[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Bertie22[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Andrew:Oxford[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Bertie22[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Andrew:Oxford[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]J B Blackett[/bold] wrote: These sly greedy money-grubbing people are determined to concrete over the whole of Southern England - and stuff the consequences as long as there is crooked money in it for them[/p][/quote]What would you do instead? Perhaps demand that people, the day after retirement, immediately sell their homes and move somewhere with plenty of empty housing... Hull? Liverpool? Ireland? Or maybe something a bit more radical? Social housing tenants forced to move somewhere cheaper to allow someone who has found a job somewhere to live in Oxford? It would make sense if you consider the carbon impact... Which would you recommend?[/p][/quote]Calm down, Norris[/p][/quote]Thanks Bertie :) Took me a moment to find the reference... For people who don't know it, it's a new cartoon character... "...Norris has eyes as blue as fjords and blond hair, as spiky as a hedgehog. Norris is tall, strong and very athletic..." Well, you're right on the blond hair, blue eyes and tall. Maybe if I were to swim and gym more than a couple of times a week I'd be the rest too.[/p][/quote]Try Coronation Street[/p][/quote]I think the first reference (from "The Guardian" yesterday) is far better. :) I've previously turned down the opportunity to play a "walk-on" part on that particular ITV series. It's a bit "Northern".[/p][/quote]Nope, definitely the corrie character is more apt for you[/p][/quote]I'm quite sure "The Guardian" reference is the right one, it's the first that came up on Google. There may well be a subliminal connection there - clearly you embrace the regular goings on of the fictional street in Manchester, so probably read "The Guardian" which was, of course, orginally "The Manchester Guardian". After reading the story you immediately associated "Tall, strong, athletic, blond haired, blue eyed and intelligent" with me. You are "Bertie" with an "ie" so I'm really quite flattered. (But no touching, thank you.) Andrew:Oxford
  • Score: -1

6:12pm Thu 4 Jul 13

Bertie22 says...

Andrew:Oxford wrote:
Bertie22 wrote:
Andrew:Oxford wrote:
Bertie22 wrote:
Andrew:Oxford wrote:
Bertie22 wrote:
Andrew:Oxford wrote:
J B Blackett wrote: These sly greedy money-grubbing people are determined to concrete over the whole of Southern England - and stuff the consequences as long as there is crooked money in it for them
What would you do instead? Perhaps demand that people, the day after retirement, immediately sell their homes and move somewhere with plenty of empty housing... Hull? Liverpool? Ireland? Or maybe something a bit more radical? Social housing tenants forced to move somewhere cheaper to allow someone who has found a job somewhere to live in Oxford? It would make sense if you consider the carbon impact... Which would you recommend?
Calm down, Norris
Thanks Bertie :) Took me a moment to find the reference... For people who don't know it, it's a new cartoon character... "...Norris has eyes as blue as fjords and blond hair, as spiky as a hedgehog. Norris is tall, strong and very athletic..." Well, you're right on the blond hair, blue eyes and tall. Maybe if I were to swim and gym more than a couple of times a week I'd be the rest too.
Try Coronation Street
I think the first reference (from "The Guardian" yesterday) is far better. :) I've previously turned down the opportunity to play a "walk-on" part on that particular ITV series. It's a bit "Northern".
Nope, definitely the corrie character is more apt for you
I'm quite sure "The Guardian" reference is the right one, it's the first that came up on Google.

There may well be a subliminal connection there - clearly you embrace the regular goings on of the fictional street in Manchester, so probably read "The Guardian" which was, of course, orginally "The Manchester Guardian".

After reading the story you immediately associated "Tall, strong, athletic, blond haired, blue eyed and intelligent" with me.

You are "Bertie" with an "ie" so I'm really quite flattered. (But no touching, thank you.)
No I didn't

You're obviously deluded as well
[quote][p][bold]Andrew:Oxford[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Bertie22[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Andrew:Oxford[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Bertie22[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Andrew:Oxford[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Bertie22[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Andrew:Oxford[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]J B Blackett[/bold] wrote: These sly greedy money-grubbing people are determined to concrete over the whole of Southern England - and stuff the consequences as long as there is crooked money in it for them[/p][/quote]What would you do instead? Perhaps demand that people, the day after retirement, immediately sell their homes and move somewhere with plenty of empty housing... Hull? Liverpool? Ireland? Or maybe something a bit more radical? Social housing tenants forced to move somewhere cheaper to allow someone who has found a job somewhere to live in Oxford? It would make sense if you consider the carbon impact... Which would you recommend?[/p][/quote]Calm down, Norris[/p][/quote]Thanks Bertie :) Took me a moment to find the reference... For people who don't know it, it's a new cartoon character... "...Norris has eyes as blue as fjords and blond hair, as spiky as a hedgehog. Norris is tall, strong and very athletic..." Well, you're right on the blond hair, blue eyes and tall. Maybe if I were to swim and gym more than a couple of times a week I'd be the rest too.[/p][/quote]Try Coronation Street[/p][/quote]I think the first reference (from "The Guardian" yesterday) is far better. :) I've previously turned down the opportunity to play a "walk-on" part on that particular ITV series. It's a bit "Northern".[/p][/quote]Nope, definitely the corrie character is more apt for you[/p][/quote]I'm quite sure "The Guardian" reference is the right one, it's the first that came up on Google. There may well be a subliminal connection there - clearly you embrace the regular goings on of the fictional street in Manchester, so probably read "The Guardian" which was, of course, orginally "The Manchester Guardian". After reading the story you immediately associated "Tall, strong, athletic, blond haired, blue eyed and intelligent" with me. You are "Bertie" with an "ie" so I'm really quite flattered. (But no touching, thank you.)[/p][/quote]No I didn't You're obviously deluded as well Bertie22
  • Score: -34

8:41am Fri 5 Jul 13

King Joke says...

jockox3 wrote:
The sly greedy money-grabbing folk are those who demand their house prices remain high whilst others struggle for housing. Even in the South-East of England, if we all lived at the density of a Singapore or Monaco we'd all fit on the Isle of Wight and the rest could be "green and pleasant land". Just look at a Google earth image of Oxfordshire - nowhere near "concreted over". People are making up self-interested excuses for preventing others having a decent standard of living.
I couldn't disagree more Jock - the only thing that makes this country liveable is the green lungs between our towns and the peace and recreation they offer to our people. We lose this at our peril.

Of course we have to house, employ and service an increasing population, but deregulation will just lead to this being done the 'private develope' way - with bland, low-density, entirely car-based development. So not only do we lose our countryside, we choke to death on traffic. A glance at LA shows what happens when this kind of development is taken to its logical conclusion.

We could easily accommodate more homes, shops and businesses in our towns if we used land more cleverly. Low-intensity land use in our towns, like car parks and big private gardens should be the first to go. The St Clements car park debate shows the mountain we have to climb to develop sensible land use policies.
[quote][p][bold]jockox3[/bold] wrote: The sly greedy money-grabbing folk are those who demand their house prices remain high whilst others struggle for housing. Even in the South-East of England, if we all lived at the density of a Singapore or Monaco we'd all fit on the Isle of Wight and the rest could be "green and pleasant land". Just look at a Google earth image of Oxfordshire - nowhere near "concreted over". People are making up self-interested excuses for preventing others having a decent standard of living.[/p][/quote]I couldn't disagree more Jock - the only thing that makes this country liveable is the green lungs between our towns and the peace and recreation they offer to our people. We lose this at our peril. Of course we have to house, employ and service an increasing population, but deregulation will just lead to this being done the 'private develope' way - with bland, low-density, entirely car-based development. So not only do we lose our countryside, we choke to death on traffic. A glance at LA shows what happens when this kind of development is taken to its logical conclusion. We could easily accommodate more homes, shops and businesses in our towns if we used land more cleverly. Low-intensity land use in our towns, like car parks and big private gardens should be the first to go. The St Clements car park debate shows the mountain we have to climb to develop sensible land use policies. King Joke
  • Score: 0

8:53am Fri 5 Jul 13

King Joke says...

Oh, and the anti-reservoir campaigners do look a bit silly now. With some imagination, a reservoir could have been disguised as a hill - reflecting maybe the Whittenham Clumps - with a boat club, picnic areas, woods and a peripheral cycle path.

Instead we'll get 30k houses with no shops, pub or bus service, a sad precedent set across the country for the last 40 years.
Oh, and the anti-reservoir campaigners do look a bit silly now. With some imagination, a reservoir could have been disguised as a hill - reflecting maybe the Whittenham Clumps - with a boat club, picnic areas, woods and a peripheral cycle path. Instead we'll get 30k houses with no shops, pub or bus service, a sad precedent set across the country for the last 40 years. King Joke
  • Score: 8

9:52am Fri 5 Jul 13

Citizen Sunday says...

Very well said, King Joke, on all points.
Just for my personal clarification, though, when you used the term "bland", could that also be used to mean "monotone"?
Very well said, King Joke, on all points. Just for my personal clarification, though, when you used the term "bland", could that also be used to mean "monotone"? Citizen Sunday
  • Score: -14

10:04am Fri 5 Jul 13

King Joke says...

I'm going to regret this aren't I Citizen? If you're referring to the Dudman Way flats, they are not entirely monotone, the grey render is relieved with a bit of weather-boarding and some coloured glass. Can you imagine the outcry however if the render had been painted in multiple colours?? I think the battleship grey was tactical, to try and make them inconspicuous, not that it worked...
I'm going to regret this aren't I Citizen? If you're referring to the Dudman Way flats, they are not entirely monotone, the grey render is relieved with a bit of weather-boarding and some coloured glass. Can you imagine the outcry however if the render had been painted in multiple colours?? I think the battleship grey was tactical, to try and make them inconspicuous, not that it worked... King Joke
  • Score: 5

4:58pm Fri 5 Jul 13

Citizen Sunday says...

King Joke wrote:
I'm going to regret this aren't I Citizen? If you're referring to the Dudman Way flats, they are not entirely monotone, the grey render is relieved with a bit of weather-boarding and some coloured glass. Can you imagine the outcry however if the render had been painted in multiple colours?? I think the battleship grey was tactical, to try and make them inconspicuous, not that it worked...
Regret? Heaven forbid, King...
I'd say we argue from the same base premise on most issues surrounding urban development and rural preservation, but tend to differ on aesthetics and the 'fixtures and fittings'.
[quote][p][bold]King Joke[/bold] wrote: I'm going to regret this aren't I Citizen? If you're referring to the Dudman Way flats, they are not entirely monotone, the grey render is relieved with a bit of weather-boarding and some coloured glass. Can you imagine the outcry however if the render had been painted in multiple colours?? I think the battleship grey was tactical, to try and make them inconspicuous, not that it worked...[/p][/quote]Regret? Heaven forbid, King... I'd say we argue from the same base premise on most issues surrounding urban development and rural preservation, but tend to differ on aesthetics and the 'fixtures and fittings'. Citizen Sunday
  • Score: -12

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